Necro skills: you are offered this - what do you take?

[cromulantkeith]

Lets say you are relatively low level, and already have:

Eternal servitude
Raise skeleton archers

(I think most would agree these 2 are usually first picks).

Which do you go for next?

- Advanced/expert necromancy (in order to really start the ball rolling on skeletal archers. The faster you get set up on this, the faster you start really farming the map, and becoming unstoppable. Your exponential army increases begin sooner.)

- Summoning magic upgrades (in order to reach master of life)

- Basic attack (in the hopes of getting archery, that +1 to min/max dmg skill, and even just the attack + dmg bonuses)

(edit: I know you can't get all 3 of these offered at the same time, but lets say you get 2 of the 3 offered)


I usually tend to try and pump the crap out of my necromancy first, building the necromancy increasing building asap, and start farming the map for high number/weak army stacks like peasants.

What do you guys go for first?

[DaemianLucifer]

Id go for necromancy first.The sooner you start,the better.

[Lord Zeus]

I'd go for archers ->
eternal servitude (this is based on hero level and other things, probably, therefor in the begining you won't be able to raise lots of dead units + no high level units too) ->
offense
Under offense I take frenzy -> cold steel and archery

[King Imp]

Instead of Attack, I would try to take Dark Magic if offered.

Everything else I agree with though.

[Wolfshanze]

Summoning and Dark Magic (in that order) are priorities to start getting early... Summoning magic with the Animate Dead spell combine to prevent you from losing any undead in combat ever.

Building up Summoning Magic is a must.

[Nebs]

I'd say there are more usefull skills than summoning magic. Not really needed as Raise Dead is lv.2 spell. Attack, dark magic, defense, logs, luck, would take all of them before summoning magic. SM is nice for campaign, but for regular maps, those mentioned skills are much better to take them earlier than sm.

[Gus]

I'm amazed that after such a short while and an almost non-existent MP environment, you can say in such an absolute tone that "Summoning Magic is a must"...

Of course it's nice to revive units, but Necros do not NECESSARILY need that to win. Or maybe they do, but it's way too early to tell.

[ThunderTitan]

Necromancy first. Raise Dead works even without Summoning. You can always take it later on, when you lose more creatures in combat. But first you need to get those creatures.

[Belmarduk]

I'd say there are more usefull skills than summoning magic. Not really needed as Raise Dead is lv.2 spell. Attack, dark magic, defense, logs, luck, would take all of them before summoning magic. SM is nice for campaign, but for regular maps, those mentioned skills are much better to take them earlier than sm.

Maxing summoning magic lets you use phantom forces on tier 7. I'm sorry, but Expert summoning is superior to anything. It also lets you raise a lot more per casting of raise dead.

[Wolfshanze]

I'd say there are more usefull skills than summoning magic. Not really needed as Raise Dead is lv.2 spell. Attack, dark magic, defense, logs, luck, would take all of them before summoning magic. SM is nice for campaign, but for regular maps, those mentioned skills are much better to take them earlier than sm.

I'd love to play you in multiplayer if that's how you think.

Do you know how many undead a non-summoner like yourself can raise with the spell vs how many skeletons an EXPERT in Summoning magic can re-animate (plus not to mention expert Phantom Forces or Summon Phoenix).

If you think merely possessing a spell is all there is to Animate Dead, vs being an expert in Summoning Magic with Master of Life, I'll take you on ANY DAY, my Necro vs your Necro... I'd mop the floor with your Necro.

In fact, it's more important for a Necro to have Summoning Magic then Death Magic (though I prefer to have both).

Do you also think just having Lightning Bolt from a non destructive-magic user is the same as an expert in destructive magic with a lightning bolt? Having the spell is a TON differant then being a master at the spell!

[ThunderTitan]

In fact, it's more important for a Necro to have Summoning Magic then Death Magic (though I prefer to have both).

Mostly because there's no such thing as Death Magic in H5.

[Wolfshanze]

In fact, it's more important for a Necro to have Summoning Magic then Death Magic (though I prefer to have both).

Mostly because there's no such thing as Death Magic in H5.

Is it your hobby in life to follow every post and pick apart what I'm saying when you (and everbody else I'm sure) know what I'm talking about?

Death/Dark... oh please forgive me for this eternal sin... I'll just call you the new Grammar Police on the forum.

[Gus]

Well, it IS tempting, when someone talks in absolutes, to pick up mistakes like that.

It was rather silly, but i did giggle at the way he picked that up

[Anthriel]

I disagree with quite a lot in this thread. First off, I assume everyone takes Vladimir, because frankly, he is by far the best Necro Hero, no one else comes close. Mostly because all other heroes have just a 50% chance of getting Raise Dead, and are screwed if it doesn't show up.

The first skill I would take is Dark Magic. Not for the spells, but for Mark of the Necromancer, which effectively means that you can no longer lose troops in battle. That makes it better than Eternal Servitude, or basically anything else.

If I don't have that as one of my choices then I would first go for Offense. The abilities in that are vital for your success, and Offense doesn't show up too often.

If I cannot get that either, then my next priority would be Summoning Magic (assuming I don't have Vladimir), as it is quite important in the long term as well, though you are quite likely to get it offered sooner or later anyway.

Once I have the most important skills, Dark Magic, Summoning Magic and Offense on basic level and therefore secured, I would invest all level ups in Necromancy.

After a while, but not on the first level up, I would take Skeleton Archers. The ability isn't important at first, because you can just use your second hero to upgrade the archers and bring them to the main hero, but after a while, those trips will take too long.

Eternal Servitude isn't important when playing Vladimir, because you usally don't take any losses anyway, but for other heroes it can be taken if you don't get anything vital.

[Gus]

First off, I assume everyone takes Vladimir, because frankly, he is by far the best Necro Hero, no one else comes close. Mostly because all other heroes have just a 50% chance of getting Raise Dead, and are screwed if it doesn't show up.

or you could try another approach, for variety, fun and enjoyment =)
i get bored pretty quickly, playing with Vladimir or Deleb or Ossir or (interactive forum: put your own overpowered hero's name here !)

[ThunderTitan]

Is it your hobby in life to follow every post and pick apart what I'm saying when you (and everbody else I'm sure) know what I'm talking about?

No.. I actualy have many other hobbies too. UR not special in any way...

I don't actualy see Dark Magic as that important to a Necromancer. And it sure isn't an equivalent to H4's Death Magic.

[Nebs]

Maxing summoning magic lets you use phantom forces on tier 7. I'm sorry, but Expert summoning is superior to anything. It also lets you raise a lot more per casting of raise dead.

Bloody excellent, lets clone spectral dragons, not those skeleton archers.

I'd love to play you in multiplayer if that's how you think.

Sure, as soon as Ubi Shit fix multiplayer issues, I'm game.

Do you know how many undead a non-summoner like yourself can raise with the spell vs how many skeletons an EXPERT in Summoning magic can re-animate (plus not to mention expert Phantom Forces or Summon Phoenix).

I'll take a wild guess, 187503 hit points more. You completly disregard the fact that non-summoner might not lose that much hit points due to having those different skills. And still having Raise Dead. And good that you didn't mention Phantom Forces of Summon Phoenix, coz then you should mention Earthquake, Firewall, Arcane Armour. But guess in your games you always get PF and SP.

If you think merely possessing a spell is all there is to Animate Dead, vs being an expert in Summoning Magic with Master of Life,...

I never said that. Ofcourse being expert is better than being with no mastery.

...I'll take you on ANY DAY, my Necro vs your Necro... I'd mop the floor with your Necro.

I've played more than 200 H3 multi games, and lost quiiiiiite a few of them, so this wouldn't be surprising at all.

In fact, it's more important for a Necro to have Summoning Magic then Death Magic (though I prefer to have both).

In fact, it's more important for a Necro to have Summoning Magic then Death Magic - for you. This is just how one feels. I feel having those debuffers is much better than depending on luck to get some of those 4 useful summoning magic spells.

Do you also think just having Lightning Bolt from a non destructive-magic user is the same as an expert in destructive magic with a lightning bolt? Having the spell is a TON differant then being a master at the spell!

No, you silly goose! Noone can argue that 11*Power is not weaker than 20*Power. But ofcourse, you just assumed some things and posted that nonsense.

[Alamar]

Lets say you are relatively low level, and already have:

Eternal servitude
Raise skeleton archers

(I think most would agree these 2 are usually first picks).

Which do you go for next?

- Advanced/expert necromancy (in order to really start the ball rolling on skeletal archers. The faster you get set up on this, the faster you start really farming the map, and becoming unstoppable. Your exponential army increases begin sooner.)

- Summoning magic upgrades (in order to reach master of life)

- Basic attack (in the hopes of getting archery, that +1 to min/max dmg skill, and even just the attack + dmg bonuses)

(edit: I know you can't get all 3 of these offered at the same time, but lets say you get 2 of the 3 offered)


I usually tend to try and pump the crap out of my necromancy first, building the necromancy increasing building asap, and start farming the map for high number/weak army stacks like peasants.

What do you guys go for first?

The skill that I would take next would honestly depend on what my other skills were and exactly what was going on.

If you were offered Expert Necromancy or Basic Summoning then I would look to see if the hero had other skills worth raising. If so then I'd take expert Necromancy. On the other hand if the hero had CRAP skills then I'd go ahead and take Basic Summoning so you know on your next level up or two you'll have skills/abilities worth raising.

If you were offered Expert Necromancy or Basic Offense then I would take Basic Offense on maps that I have a lot of time to develop because you won't get offered Offense often. On small maps it's probably more important to max out Necromancy fast and max out whatever your spell guilds best school is.

Note if you don't get raise dead in your spell guild and you notice fairly lack-luster summoning spells then Summoning Magic can probably wait.

[Metathron]

I have just started the Necromancer campaign and would like to pose a question: The Death Lord skill sounds over powered, at least in theory. How does it turn out in practice?

[Gus]

Well, in practice, it is the same as in other campaigns, were troops of your alignment are scripted to join you =)