Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

The role-playing games (I-X) that started it all and the various spin-offs (including Dark Messiah).
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby KDark » 05 Apr 2024, 02:05

Would anyone be willing to integrate some of the character selections from Maestro's MM7 mod into MMMerge? I'd love to be able to use the PC06 and PC10 characters. If not, can someone perhaps suggest how I could go about integrating them in myself? I know how to extract and replace the files so I can get the faces part to work but I don't know how to get the characters to line up with the background and the limbs to line up with the characters. Thank you for any assistance anyone can provide.
Last edited by KDark on 05 Apr 2024, 03:23, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby Gray Magic Expert » 05 Apr 2024, 05:36

Rodril wrote: 04 Apr 2024, 22:55 Artifact is replaced by gemstone, when one is already acquired by the party. Cannot check other points at the moment.
Hmmm. Then something even stranger is at play.
My curremt party started in MM7.

The first artifact-specific chest I ever reached was the one near Erathia Obelisk.
It didn't give me artifact, so I was dissapointed and re-loaded the autosave. Still no Artifact.
Then I decided that MMMerge does not spawn artifacts at this particular place anymore, because vanilla mm7 does not have them there... And I didn't bother trying a few more times. However - on those two tries there were expensive mm8 gemstones in this chest!

And now, despite having only a few artifacts (Herondale's Shield from Ravenshore and Hades from some Random chest), the game likes to shower me in gemstones, when oppening the secret wall in Alvar, or the Artifact Vault in Klanker's Lab.

Weird Hypothesis (seems unlikely, but who knows...): maybe the game thinks, that I already gathered most of MM7 and MM6 artifacts? And if it does - then why is this happening?

Edit, 06 april 2024:
10 attempts at generating Alvar Hidden Artifact Chest:
1 - Havoc Sword
2 - Berserker Belt
3 - Gemstone
4 - Gemstone
5 - Gemstone
6 - Fleetfingers
7 - Crown of the Final Dominion
8 - Gemstone
9 - Ring of Fusion
10 - Gemstone
Half of attempts resulted in gemstones! This is very strange, because the only MM8 artifact I have is the Herondale Lost Shield... And the only non-mm8 artifact is the Hades Sword.

Edit, 07 april 2024:
The current vesrion of MM Merge correctly genrates all artifacts (mm6, mm7, and mm8) in Tier 6 item slots (see chests in Dragonsand Desert for example) However, artifact-guaranteed chests generate only mm8 artifact items, and nothing else.

Also, ammount of gemstones felt a bit over the top during all my tests, but maybe it was just bad luck... I did recieve a same artifact on two reloads in a row, after all.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby GothiCa » 06 Apr 2024, 14:55

Greetings friends! Great job - just a blessing! Thanks a lot!
There is a great desire to pass on difficulty 200 without rewriting, without dying! I tried a batch of level 15 characters, completed the 8th part, and moved on to the 6th. Hydras and titans have 5000 life each - why? I believed that monsters became stronger depending on the level of my group. Apparently from something else - from stats? on equipment level? From skill strength?
Please help me find the formulas... Or at least explain the principle of strengthening monsters. (Sorry for my poor knowledge of English)

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby thorn3000 » 07 Apr 2024, 17:39

first of all big thanks and respect to all the people involved in any way in creating or helping create this mod, I'm new here, recently discovered World of Enroth, but a long time MM fan, since MM3 must have played and finished every game of the franchise including spinoffs

I have a question tho in case somebody has a moment, is it possible in any way to change a characters Voice once character creation is finished and you are ingame?

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby Kinox » 08 Apr 2024, 15:34

thorn3000 wrote: 07 Apr 2024, 17:39 first of all big thanks and respect to all the people involved in any way in creating or helping create this mod, I'm new here, recently discovered World of Enroth, but a long time MM fan, since MM3 must have played and finished every game of the franchise including spinoffs

I have a question tho in case somebody has a moment, is it possible in any way to change a characters Voice once character creation is finished and you are ingame?
Hello there; and welcome, Adventurer!

Yes, it is totally possible.

But I just know one method:

I use Cheat Engine (CE), along with a specialized CE file for MMMerge.
The software is free to download, but using it is not trivial --some tasks are pretty simple though.

This is the CE file (I've upgraded it from the original file that someone prepared years ago for CE; and I made it so that all 50 Playable Characters are editable, and not just the 5 of Party Creation; but technically for what you need, you might just require the original one; there should be a link for it somewhere):
https://www.celestialheavens.com/forum/ ... rs#p390827

Basically, you need to:
1) Be playing MMMerge, in a current game.
2) Open CE
3) Link the correct running program (MMMerge) to CE
4) Open that CE file (of the Characters) into CE
5) Look for the list on the bottom area of CE, where you should find Characters
6) Check boxes relative to the things you want to change (i.e., Voice), and find the number of the wanted Voice in a popup menu (there is about 60 Voices in MMMerge to choose from
7) The game gets instant and realtime update from CE (for Check boxes), but some visual updates get glitched until some event like Save and Load.
7a) If you make the realtime changes, Save the game, you may already close CE. Then Load the game. Note that if you keep running CE while playing, I believe this can cause cyclic stuff, if you have Checked boxes (being edited).

I have a list of the Portraits and Voices, but it's incomplete;
usually, the same number that is associated to the Portrait, matches perfetly with the one of the Voice; but there seem to be tiny structural mistakes (that I haven't been able to revise yet):

number (referring to Portrait or Voice, in CE's data ordering regarding MMMerge) /// Portrait|Voice /// famous Character (MM8)
00 MM8-Kn-m-1 Simon Templar
01 MM8-Kn-f-1
02 MM8-Kn-m-2 Blazen Stormlance
03 MM8-Kn-f-2 Leane Stormlance
04 MM8-Cl-m-1 Fredrick Talimere
05 MM8-Cl-f-1
06 MM8-Cl-m-2 Deyson Leyland
07 MM8-Cl-f-2
08 MM8-Ne-m-1 Devlin Arcanus
09 MM8-Ne-f-1 Karanya Memoria
10 MM8-Ne-m-2 Nathaniel Roberts
11 MM8-Ne-f-2
12 MM8-Va-m-1 Gethric Mercutura
13 MM8-Va-f-1 Elsbeth Lamentia
14 MM8-Va-m-2 Artorius Veritas
15 MM8-Va-f-2
16 MM8-DE-m-1 Jasp Thelbourne
17 MM8-DE-f-1 Rohani Oscleton
18 MM8-DE-m-2 Adric Stellare
19 MM8-DE-f-2 Cauri Blackthorne
20 MM8-Mi-1 Arius
21 MM8-Mi-2 Ulbrecht
22 MM8-Tr-1 Overdune Snapfinger
23 MM8-Tr-2 Volog Sandwind
24 MM8-Dg-1 Ithilgore
25 MM8-Dg-2 Flamdring
26 MM8-Li-m Vetrinus Taleshire
27 MM8-Li-f Hevatia Deverbero
28
29
30
31 MM7-El-f-2
32 MM7-El-m-2
33 MM7-El-f-1
34 MM7-El-m-1
35 MM7-m-Hu-3
36 MM7-m-Hu-2
37 MM6-m
38 MM6-f
39 MM6-m
40 MM6-f
41 MM6-m
42 MM6-f
43 MM6-m
44 MM6-f
45 MM6-m
46 MM6-m
47 MM6-m
48 MM6-m
49 MM7-m-Hu-1
50 MM7-f-Hu-1
51 MM7-m-Hu-2
52 MM7-f-Hu-3
53 MM7-m-Hu-4
54 MM7-f-Hu-4
55 MM7-m-Go-2
56 MM7-f-Go-1
57 MM7-m-Go-1
58 MM7-f-Go-2
59
60
61
62 MM7-m-Dw-1
63 MM7-f-Dw-1
64 MM7-f-Dw-2
65
66
67
68

Hope that helps.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby thorn3000 » 08 Apr 2024, 17:19

Kinox wrote: 08 Apr 2024, 15:34 Hope that helps.
Thanks mate, was able to change it :yes:

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby TheTate » 08 Apr 2024, 22:09

Has anybody made a readable list for what races get a bonus to what skills? I know minotaurs get a bonus to axe, but beyond that, I'm at a loss.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby TheTate » 09 Apr 2024, 21:52

One other thing that's baffling me is how the Acolyte of the Light, which from what I can gather is the MM8 Cleric, is for some reason restricted to expert in Light magic.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby raekuul » 09 Apr 2024, 23:33

I believe that's so that you have three classes (base, first promotion, second promotion) per character instead of just two, like you would for the other continents. There should be an NPC to promote your character to the Priest-equivalent.

Light stopping at Expert for Acolyte is on track with the other continents' - Sorcerers need to be promoted to Wizard before they can master Water magic, Clerics have to be promoted to Priest before they can master Body magic, etc.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby TheTate » 10 Apr 2024, 15:54

raekuul wrote: 09 Apr 2024, 23:33 I believe that's so that you have three classes (base, first promotion, second promotion) per character instead of just two, like you would for the other continents. There should be an NPC to promote your character to the Priest-equivalent.

Light stopping at Expert for Acolyte is on track with the other continents' - Sorcerers need to be promoted to Wizard before they can master Water magic, Clerics have to be promoted to Priest before they can master Body magic, etc.
Master and Grandmaster are in red text, not yellow, meaning that it's not locked behind promotion- it just can't be attained at all.
By comparison, Acolyte of the Dark has M and GM rank in yellow text, meaning available after promotion.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby Talin_Trollbane » 10 Apr 2024, 17:44

Ok, i caved in and dl'd the merge mod with the revamp version, got a party together again and started in MM6, had those sound issues (but fixed it since i forgot to do the windows XP sp3 comp thing.) cleared out alot of the Sorpigal map and entered cursed temple, but i get this wierd error:
i cant enter any of the magic guilds, game just crashes. I can enter everything else both the two guilds at the edge of town is impossible.

Anyone knows why?
Ultima, Elder Scrolls and Might and Magic Veteran.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby Kinox » 10 Apr 2024, 18:52

Latest MMMerge Base version (more info about a game crashing bug):

Hi. So, I remember someone has posted recenty about having experienced crash in Alvar.

I experience the same thing, and I seem to have found some patterns:

The game crashes in about 10 seconds (e.g. after Load), if we walk forward toward Alvar city, at night time.
If we walk, keep Saving and Loading after crashes (meaning we have to re-open the entire game everytime), we can keep postponing the crash gradually, and eventually get in the center of town in spite of the issue.

Intriguingly, if the Party walks backwards (not facing some crashing feature that seem to be present in the center of the town of Alvar), crashes won't occur; however, if we cross the center of the town this way, and keep going, we'll end up looking toward to center of the town, but from the opposite side, and this seems to resume crashing events.

Similar crashes at night may occur in other towns: Raveshore, and I believe also I've seen that in Erathia.

I suspect the culprits could be some Town/Region Map light source, such as a Pedestal or a Brazier. That would make more sense, because lighting is a more proheminent element of the environment, that relates to night time.

Hope this will be turned useful.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby N7Kopper » 10 Apr 2024, 22:15

Been getting proper stuck in with MMMerge the past week or so after a while playing World of Xeen on ScummVM - I beat Clouds at least! Didn't really play much 6 growing up - more my older brother's game - and never played 7 or 8 at all. This is the sort of ambitious thing that's been happening a lot recently, decompliations, fan ports and the like. Says a lot about games like Starfield that modders gave up on them! XD Given World of Xeen and it's Sonic 3 and Knuckles-style shenanigans, MMMerge is even on-brand for this series. (as a side note, I find it hilarious that it was the playerbase of HoMM who were responsible for retconning MM7 to make the Light ending canon, because they didn't understand that MM was a sci-fi and got scared of all the Forge faction's magitech weapons!)
Kinox wrote: 08 Apr 2024, 15:34
thorn3000 wrote: 07 Apr 2024, 17:39first of all big thanks and respect to all the people involved in any way in creating or helping create this mod, I'm new here, recently discovered World of Enroth, but a long time MM fan, since MM3 must have played and finished every game of the franchise including spinoffs

I have a question tho in case somebody has a moment, is it possible in any way to change a characters Voice once character creation is finished and you are ingame?
This is the CE file (I've upgraded it from the original file that someone prepared years ago for CE; and I made it so that all 50 Playable Characters are editable, and not just the 5 of Party Creation; but technically for what you need, you might just require the original one; there should be a link for it somewhere):
https://www.celestialheavens.com/forum/ ... rs#p390827
Don't worry, your 50 character version has the Voice addresses properly mapped out. Just for future reference. :)

By the way, thanks for that! I in fact needed to edit some hirelings to inject myself a new party for when I tackle MM7. Well, three of them. I want to keep character 0 and some random beggar peasant recruit I grew a soft spot for. (She just wanted food! XD) And then I got adventurous and decided to go poking in RAM to inject some character bios - hey, I needed to RENAME them too! That went surprisingly well. Did you know that MMMerge pads out the bio section of recruits with a string of Blahs after the terminator (00 in hex)? Your starter party get the "Renowned Hero of Jadame" string overwritten with the MMMerge default bio for custom PCs and then a bunch of null bytes. Best to use a recruit for string length reference lest you clobber data.
--------------------------------------------------
That being said, a completely unrelated (I checked!) thing happened to me while exploring the Tomb of VARN. I say this because I don't know if it was a Base MMMerge bug, a multiplayer bug - even though I was playing solo, and apparently those modules don't even load unless you're in LAN/Internet mode - or just cosmic radiation (not the in-universe stuff in the pyramid either!). Said Character 0, a Black Knight named Keira... well... she's SUPPOSED to be 22 like my Hero, but she's... 1174 years old somehow. Natural aging - magical aging is pretty obvious. So now I either need to find what memory address holds a character's birth year and set it back using an old save for reference or figure out how to do the same via Lua. That'll be fun... in the hair-pulling yet satisfying once done kinda way. Just for context, she was the party leader at the time... unless you actually can't remove Char 0 from the party and it's not just that I haven't figured out how yet. (Been trying to avoid any gameplay hints! Bah! I'm writing my own for myself!)
Last edited by N7Kopper on 10 Apr 2024, 22:16, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby GothiCa » 12 Apr 2024, 14:07

Friends, please tell me, has the bug with horseshoe clones when moving to a region been fixed? Thanks in advance!

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby Tomsod » 13 Apr 2024, 04:02

GothiCa wrote: 12 Apr 2024, 14:07 Friends, please tell me, has the bug with horseshoe clones when moving to a region been fixed? Thanks in advance!
I believe MMPatch v2.5.6 has finally fixed it. The fix can be toggled off (see patch changelog) if that's what you're wondering about.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby GothiCa » 13 Apr 2024, 12:01

Tomsod - thanks for the answer! (this just spoiled the game moment).
There is another question: if we edit in the skill table, say a human knight and give him the abilities of a dragon - G (which immediately develop to grand by default), can we, by pumping up the skill of a dragon, get him E/M/G or is a dragon required - race like base?

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby N7Kopper » 13 Apr 2024, 13:39

All right, I've done some basic figuring out. I ran

Code: Select all

> dump(Party[0].BirthYear)
  "0"
> dump(Party[1].BirthYear)
  "1151"
 --With 0 being my BK and 1 being my Hero
and it's as I suspected: Keira's BirthYear bytes got corrupted: my bet is legitimately Cosmic Rays at this point, because I wasn't even running Cheat Engine in the pyramid, and nobody else has had this issue with either Party Member 0 or Character 0.

Either way, I don't know the second thing about Lua syntax (I used the first thing to find the info I needed :P) so I used Cheat Engine to set the Birth Year. By the way, Character 0's Birth Year is found at MM8.exe+72347C. Maybe later I'll offset through all character slots and update the address list. :)

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby N7Kopper » 14 Apr 2024, 15:22

GothiCa wrote: 13 Apr 2024, 12:01 Tomsod - thanks for the answer! (this just spoiled the game moment).
There is another question: if we edit in the skill table, say a human knight and give him the abilities of a dragon - G (which immediately develop to grand by default), can we, by pumping up the skill of a dragon, get him E/M/G or is a dragon required - race like base?
If this is base Merge, I believe (don't quote me!) that the only actual racial things dragons have are starting stat pools, equipment restrictions, and possibly the unarmed attack being a breath weapon rather than punching things (because dragons can't hold a sword or get their huge fingers in a trigger guard!). Merge races work like most MM games; it's portraits and starting stats that differ. (If you enable free character creation, you can make a Dark Elf of the Dragon class just as easily as a Troll of the Troll class) The Dragon Ability spells are tied to your class, not your race - so if you give Knight and its promotions Dragon Ability, all Knights of all races will be able to learn it - but I don't think anyone teaches basic Dragon Ability, so you'll need to start with it or directly modify your characters to get it.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby Kinox » 14 Apr 2024, 17:57

N7Kopper wrote: 10 Apr 2024, 22:15 Don't worry, your 50 character version has the Voice addresses properly mapped out. Just for future reference. :)

By the way, thanks for that! I in fact needed to edit some hirelings to inject myself a new party for when I tackle MM7. Well, three of them. I want to keep character 0 and some random beggar peasant recruit I grew a soft spot for. (She just wanted food! XD) And then I got adventurous and decided to go poking in RAM to inject some character bios - hey, I needed to RENAME them too! That went surprisingly well. Did you know that MMMerge pads out the bio section of recruits with a string of Blahs after the terminator (00 in hex)? Your starter party get the "Renowned Hero of Jadame" string overwritten with the MMMerge default bio for custom PCs and then a bunch of null bytes. Best to use a recruit for string length reference lest you clobber data.
Yeah... What I meant was that... at some point when I was giving in CE to a Playable Character, for example, a Portrait 113 and a Voice 113 (unrealistic values in this example of course, but the important part is that they'd be matching), I believe I've seen at least one unmatching setup (if it wasn't just some wrong editing manipulation I did on a running game CE-editing). Though, if you're stating that you had/have means of verification, that all those Portrait<->Voice data are structurally matching already by default, without one having to check one by one, than this is interesting. I don't know how to reach that conclusion, without direct testing though.

Welcome. As a curiosity instance, although it wasn't easy to achieve that, but it wasn't also something too complicated. Some previous introductory Numeric Calculus concepts helped in that regard: better insight into the problematic; but it wouldn't be absolutely required. Basically, I was expecting there would exist a 'counting pattern', for all of the interesting attributes of game's 50 Playable Character addresses. I started with just the 5 Starting Party Playable Characters, but the 1st on (Character 0) was isolated from the 4 other Characters (Character 38-41); so by looking at the numerical, integer spacing/gap (translating between hexadecimals and decimals), between certain sample attributes between those 4 Characters, it was possible to reveal a counting pattern (even though there'd be attributes that were counted that I had no idea what would be about, so just counted them while ignoring their purpose completely); then, the biggest question was: is that same revealed pattern, consistent, between Character 0 to Character 38? And beyond, Character 41 to Character 49 (the last one, 50th Character)? It turned out to be true (logically, but yet, fortunately). It was perfectly regular and organized over 50 Playable Characters (why wouldn't it be, right?). Then, it turned out just to be a question of... replicating the Character editing setup (from the original CE file of just 5 Character, to the new CE file with 50 Characters). At that point, CE was particular good because, there existed an 'automation technique'; so I didn't have to individually specify, for each one of the other 45 Characters, their attributes-addressesses; it was mostly a copy-paste CE Character 'folder' thing (which was already existing in the original CE file); I believe it just copy-pasted the same original Character's template 'folder', into the remaining addresses, and since the whole pattern was apparently regular, filling perfectly the gaps (even though many, many unknown attributes to me are not readily editable from that folder template).
I still hold the addresses' list in hexadecimals which revealed for me the counting pattern for a single attribute of several Characters, but it's probably not useful anymore.

Oh yeh... For me as well, nothing beats oldschool 'Role-Playing'...... even in CRPGs. Creating special situations or even special gameplay rules, is often invaluable! Regarding Hirelings, I've been working with a few rules, but they go more into challenges than Role-playing, although one doesn't necessarily invalidate the other. It's like I have one Month in the game my Party will have inevitably to Hire a "Peasant" and keep it for that whole time! Every Day-1 of each Month, the Party must Dismiss all Hirelings (it's a Monthly Job right?), and then find new ones. House Hirelings can only be Hired once! And there is "Hirelings Fame": must achieve Unique Acormage Victories, in order to be able to Hire more costy Hirelings (e.g., must Win 20 Unique Arcomage Victories, just in order to be able to Hire a single 2K Gold Hireling and nothing else... until the end of that current Month).
I cannot use CE to Rename Characters, nor to change their biographies. If you or anyone here in the forums knows if this is possible and how, that would be great information!
But I know how to cheese that with a combination of mm8che and CE.
Basically:
1) Open game, open mm8che, Edit the Character in mm8che first (change it's Name and Biography; ignore any possible blank Portrait and/or bank/wronged Class), apply;
1a) Meanwhile, avoid looking at that Character's Inventory data (can cause game crash);
1b) Save game, close mm8che, Load game;
2) Open CE (with 'linked' game and proper CE file), Re-Edit that same Character in CE (fix the Portrait and/or Class in the process, in the case they've got corrupted by mm8che! This will happens whenever they are not MM8 instances).

It's certainly not a very funny procedure. But it gets the job done! Would be like to have the ultimate "mmmergeche" :D

Yes! I knew about the 'BlahBlah!' thing, but I don't really understand what you mean by some other ideas, like terminator 00-hex, etc. Also, 'the Renowned Hero of Jadame' Biography was... displaced to the "clone" (Character 37). We can easily swap that Character (or actually any Character) into Party with... a more primordial technique in mm8che, that doesn't require any CE fixes! as the previous annoying editing cases.
What I'm doing, for Role-playing purposes, is I get innaccessible by default (yet Playable) Characters (like Character 36 and 37) into my Party at game start (as if they were free Characters or an extension of the 5 Party Creation Characters; so 7 instead of 5!), and then place them in the Adventurer's Inn for later. Then, in the future, depending on which sides I've chosen in Jadame's Alliances Main Quests (30-Level Recruits: Lich/Priest of the Light, Champion/Great Wyrm), I still insist on getting the inevitable prohibited ones into my game. :D Full House!

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.11.2023]

Unread postby MilesChen099 » 18 Apr 2024, 11:17

Hi everyone, what console commands should I use to force an instant map refill? Thanks!


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