Irresistible magic

[cornellian]

Sir Toejam, I haven't said a single word about you modding Heroes, I simply objected the notion that Irresistable Magic should not affect your own creatures.. In fact you can find, couple pages earlier, in one of my posts, that I suggested you do such a mod.. But of course, you haven't noticed it have you, surely not, you are too busy trying to come up with great solutions I see...

Besides, as you think your taking 12 skills for 1 spell 'solutions' pretty viable, I think that you are just arguing for the sake of it, just as I thought you would.. And by the way you don't have to change your post several times, you are very clear in what you mean already... I've given you an advice, a friendly advice as I've told, but if you are uncapable of registering that, or capable of registering that as an attack, then I guess I am writing for vain..

Oh and one more thing.. You know what's interesting; half of people that learn my profession tell me that they also work in the industry and almost always they use it so stress out their 'so what' stance.. Very curious this is.. In fact, you know, I'd love to learn the projects you had worked on, or people that you know, you never know, maybe we might know each other, though I highly doubt it.. You see, I wouldn't want to argue with a fellow 'game developer' ..

I should have known that this was a waste of time...

[Sir_Toejam]

In fact, you know, I'd love to learn the projects you had worked on, or people that you know,

I sent you a PM. You never know, maybe we did meet in a past life.

You see, I wouldn't want to argue with a fellow 'game developer' ..

a not so subtle implication that I am lying that is duly noted. Notice I could accuse you of the same thing, yes? It's a ridiculous statement on the face of it.

Sir Toejam, I haven't said a single word about you modding Heroes, I simply objected the notion that Irresistable Magic should not affect your own creatures..

in the interest of ending this, I'll just say that I'm only referring to mods, so we then have no argument of substance to continue.

[ThunderTitan]

Can someone mods this already to see what the actual effect would be?! Just so we stop making assumptions?

[Sir_Toejam]

yeah, your point is well taken. That is the only way to tell for sure.

It's just not that easy to figure out how to change how the skill works, like it is for many of the other things, like adding abilities, spell changes, stat changes, etc.

I would have already done it if it were that easy, but I would certainly encourage anybody else who has thought about it to take a gander at the game mechanics folder in the data.pak file and see if they can figure out how to change it.

[Idleness2]

I love playing dungeon and I totally voted yes here. Look, just cause BDs will be hurt by armageddon doesnt preclude you from casting it. Your enemy will take a lot more damage than you...and remember you can always hand BDs to some non dungeon hero. But hell, i NEVER get BDs anyway.
Dungeon is powerful enough as it is, we dont need help. Just cause you are lame and illogical and cant stand the thought of losing 3 of your BDs for the sake of killing massive numbers (MASSIVE) of the enemy with some spell doesnt mean that the game should support your irrationally cautious attitude. Dont make dungeon so powerful that even idiots can play it and always win.

[DaemianLucifer]

I love playing dungeon and I totally voted yes here. Look, just cause BDs will be hurt by armageddon doesnt preclude you from casting it. Your enemy will take a lot more damage than you...and remember you can always hand BDs to some non dungeon hero. But hell, i NEVER get BDs anyway.
Dungeon is powerful enough as it is, we dont need help. Just cause you are lame and illogical and cant stand the thought of losing 3 of your BDs for the sake of killing massive numbers (MASSIVE) of the enemy with some spell doesnt mean that the game should support your irrationally cautious attitude. Dont make dungeon so powerful that even idiots can play it and always win.

First of all,let me laugh out loud,and hard Second,check out this list:

eldritch arrow
stone spikes
ice bolt
lightning bolt
fireball
circle of winter
chain lightning
meteor shower
armagedon
implosion

I counted it numerous times,and I always count 10 spells.Not 1,but 10.So there are 10 spells in that list,6 of which can strike your own troops if you arent carefull enough.Thats 60% of potentially dangerous spells for you.Again,not 1 but 6.That means that 6 of your 10 spells decrease in their value when you attack when you put your dragons in the combat,even though it is a creature that should be immune to all magic.You say that we are illogical because we claim that it is weird you can hurt your magical immune creature with spells,but you cannot buff them? Im sorry,but I have to laugh again

[Idleness2]

im laughing cause u have a hard time avoiding hitting your BDs with your circle of winter spell...
just be very, very careful man...
maybe dungeon too hard in tactic for u man...

Post 2:
anyway, exaclt, u made my point for me 'if you arent careful enough', but as it is, you can be careful enough, and thats...well thats the simple part, imo, of what makes dungeon rather fun to play, the battle tactics are intellectually intriguing. so leave it as it is, its not too hard for me...

post 3:
like sure, sometimes, u gotta just smack out that chain lightning, even tho u know one of yr units are gonna get hit, u just gotta sacrifice them for that damage, and the stun and all the enemy are earth element and stuff, I like that. Like dungeon is so dangerous they can even hurt themselves, its cool man.

post4:
As an after tohught, gosh i read your thingy again, man im laughing again, that u wanna buff your BDs omg, lol

[RaSmuShaDoW]

I think it would be most logical that Black Dragons would be imune to magic in all possible situations. Like some high-end unit (which he actualy is) that neglects even racial skills and stays imune to all magic FOREVER.

That would still leave BD+ARMAGEDON combo quite riscky but would be like some Bonus for Warlocks.

[Idleness2]

ARRRGH, but BD+ armagedon is so CHEEESY, an idiot can beat anyone this way, and with irresitable magic? come on, that would make dungeon just too dang powerful...

Post 2:
then it would be like, u know, month 2 comes along, and u are playing dungeon, and just say to your enemy, oh, gosh, my mage guild got armageddon, then he of course will reply oh really? crap, i resign. Then game is over, heck is that fun for anyone?

[Naskoni]

then it would be like, u know, month 2 comes along, and u are playing dungeon, and just say to your enemy, oh, gosh, my mage guild got armageddon, then he of course will reply oh really? crap, i resign. Then game is over, heck is that fun for anyone?

What's stopping you from getting a Mage as a secondary hero and "cheesing" it anyway now, hmm?

Post 2:
And learn how to use the Edit button please!

post 3:
Because it's fricking annoying to read what otherwise is a single post of yours presented in the form of 4 consecutive postings...

[RaSmuShaDoW]

Because it's fricking annoying to read what otherwise is a single post of yours presented in the form of 4 consecutive postings...

Someting like your posts too man

In general: BD + ARMA = a very risky strategy. You can easily loose your main hero under the wrong circumstanses (non native speaker here ). Such strategy is more like the last hope then a game winnig strategy.

[DaemianLucifer]

BD+armagedon is a dumb strategy,so what?Remove armagedon,make it weaker,make it do physical damage so that BDs get hit anyway,I dont care.But why nerf the whole race because of a single spell?Hey,PF is so strong,lets nerf mages,genies,gargoyls,titans,rakshasas,gremlins and golems because of it....Oh,wait....Maybe thats why they did it in the first place...Hmmm...Does sound like nival.

As for being careful:If you engage your blackies in the middle of the enemy and want to hit them all around with fireball,or meteor shower,well guess what,you cant because youll hurt your dragons with it.Circle of winter too,because you cannot encircle a 2*2 creature.Warlock is strong on offense and week on defense so he should strike fast and hard.But how can you strike fast if your spells can kill your strongest magic immune attacker?Your dragons must wait for you to cast a spell before they attack.Thats not how offensive race should work.

[RaSmuShaDoW]

That's the same as saying that your own creatures should be imune to dragons fire breath just because you might hit them while attacking enemy

Dungeon = ofence
But Dungeon is not = ofence with no cotion

Sometimes you have to choose - Meteor Shower or Black Dragon into the middle of the fight. And you can always use Implotion

[DaemianLucifer]

But dragons are immune to magic.It would be same as if your gargoyels could be hit with your spells.Like I said,I wouldnt mind if you were able to buff blackies as well as damage them.

[Jolly Joker]

I was pretty undecided about this question, but once you really check the numbers, I think it's rather easy: a Warlock may easily have a spell power of 15. He might get the Phoenix Feather Cape, a MINOR artifact. With empowered spells that will give him something like 960 Armageddon damage (with that damage being doubled within the 4 middle squares of the battlefield where the meteor lands). That's one HELL of a lot of damage. If the Dragons would be completely immune against that, I mean, heck, do you really need other troops then? Would you really need another strategy? Do you really want to face Warlocks dealing that kind of spell damage? You can basically win all games by battling only with all your Dragons kill as much as possible than flee (if necessary at all) and come back with the rest of your army you left back home, right?

[DaemianLucifer]

How can you people be so linear?Armagedon is not the only spell a warlock has.Its one out of 10 spells in destruction magic school.And you dont even have to go with destruction magic with warlock.

[Jolly Joker]

What has that got to do with it? I mean, if Necromancy gave 10%, 50% and 100% you certainly wouldn't say, how can people be so linear; they don't even need to take Advanced and Expert Necromancy and if so they can leave the Skeletons at home. Right?
I mean, do you really expect people to say, well, okay, my Warlock now has reached spell power 20; I have Armageddon in my guild and I found the Phoenix fether Cape. One Armageddon will do 1260 damage to all stacks of my opponents while my Black Dragons will suffer no damage at all; I have enough mana to cast it four times, which will kill up to 35000 Health. Ah, heck, no, too linear, let's see whether we can win with Arkane Arrow and just the Hydras.

[DaemianLucifer]

You cannot compare necromancy with destruction magic because necromancy is a racial skill.And the game was made to focus you on your racial skills.But if your racial skill is broken,like the warlocks one is,why would you focus on it?If armagedon really is to powerfull,then nerf it,not the racial of the warlock.

[Gaidal Cain]

Mod note: I removed the annoying double- triple and quadruple-posting. I was even nice enough not to delete the messages outright. Next time, use the edit button, becuase I'm not about to do it for you.

Oh, and I'm in full agreement with DL's last post. Even if IM makes it impossible for Warlocks to use Dracageddon, there's really nothing stopping a Necromancer from taking over a dungeon and using it. Armageddon is the problem, not warlocks.

[Jolly Joker]

I think that's a wrong conclusion. Just have a look into the topics dealing with the weak destructive magic. This is not a problem of the Armageddon spell which isn't that strong with 30 + 30xPower; it's a problem of the fact that a Warlock can utilize so much spellpower and multpliers. I forgot Lucky Spells, by the way, in the first example. Who else has Destructive? Ranger and Demon Lord which don't have too many spell points; even with the Feather Cape they will be hard pressed to do more than 300 armageddon damage. But said level 15 Warlock with empowered spells, feather cape and Lucks spell will do nearly TWO THOUSAND Armageddon damage, so the problem is not the Armageddon spell, it's the Warlock.