[HoMM3] Unused features

The old Heroes games developed by New World Computing. Please specify which game you are referring to in your post.

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GreatEmerald
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[HoMM3] Unused features

Postby GreatEmerald » Aug 3 2010, 17:49

I'm digging through HoMM3 LOD files and I'm finding quite some things there that make me wonder why they were never used. So far this is what I've found:
  1. Rogue sounds. In h3ab_ahd.snd you can find unused unique sounds for Rogues. Why were they swapped with the gremlin sounds on release?
  2. Negative luck. The H3Sprite.lod has a sprite for negative luck, and some TXT files show that negative luck was supposed to make units inflict half the damage. There is also a unique unused negative luck sound. Why was the idea dropped?
  3. Luck and Morale titles. In H3ab_bmp.lod, there's a text file "ArrayTxt.txt" that has the following titles - Luck: -3 = Cursed, -2 = Awful, -1 = Bad, 0 = Normal, +1 = Good, +2 = Great, +3 = Irish; Morale: -3 = Treason, -2 = Awful, -1 = Poor, 0 = Normal, +1 = Good, +2 = Great, +3 = Blood! Why Aren't the titles used anywhere?
  4. Unused spell effects. In H3Bitmap, you can see alternative versions of Fireball, Frost Ring etc. Why weren't they used randomly or removed before release?
  5. Devil movement sound. Devils never walk for some reason, but there is a sound for that. However, it's not really a walking sound, it sounds like a laser to me...
  6. Magic Mirror is called "Backlash" internally (Heroes3.snd). Similarly, Dread Knights are called "Black Lords", Implosion is called "Decay" (in fact, even the sprite resembles decay more than implosion), Inferno is called "Fire Blast", Armageddon is called "Firestorm", Ice Bold is called "Ice Ray", Slow is called "Muck Mire", Destroy Undead is called "Sacred Breath", Haste is called "Tail wind", Stone Skin is called "Tough Skin".
  7. Beholders have an alternative death sound, gogs have an alternative fireball sound, liches have an alternative melee sound.
  8. Centaurs have a shooting sound. Interesting thing is that it's the same one that was used in HoMM4! Efreeti Sultans, Harpy Hags, Manticores, Scorpicores, Minotaur Kings, War Unicorns and Dragonflies also have a shooting sound.
  9. There are sounds for the spells Cold ray, Mirror Image, Protect, Storm and Cold Ring. There are also unused sounds "DIPMAGK" and "MNRDEATH".
  10. Slayer has an alternative sound (DRGNSLAY), and so does Fireball, Haste, Magic Arrow and Fire Shield.
  11. The mill sound is called "genie" for no apparent reason.
  12. Vampires are called "Nosferatu" and have a shooting sound (or possibly a revival sound, like it was written in the 3DO FAQ).
  13. There are three unused "play" sounds - "PLAYCOME", "PLAYEXIT", "PLAYTURN".
  14. There are two unused sounds for teleporting in that should be played after the teleporting out sound.

I'll continue the list if I find anything more interesting :)
Last edited by GreatEmerald on Aug 3 2010, 18:54, edited 8 times in total.

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Postby ByteBandit » Aug 3 2010, 17:53

I suppose they could be implemented by swapping out the originals with the new ones you found. I guess your answer lies in the source code why the're not used.

And I suppose with a little ERM scrtpting they could be used along with the originals.

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Re: [HoMM3] Unused features

Postby Qurqirish Dragon » Aug 4 2010, 13:35

GreatEmerald wrote:I'm digging through HoMM3 LOD files and I'm finding quite some things there that make me wonder why they were never used.
I would think that many of them weren't used due to changes during development.
So far this is what I've found:
[list=1]
[*]Negative luck. The H3Sprite.lod has a sprite for negative luck, and some TXT files show that negative luck was supposed to make units inflict half the damage. There is also a unique unused negative luck sound. Why was the idea dropped?
[*]Luck and Morale titles. In H3ab_bmp.lod, there's a text file "ArrayTxt.txt" that has the following titles - Luck: -3 = Cursed, -2 = Awful, -1 = Bad, 0 = Normal, +1 = Good, +2 = Great, +3 = Irish; Morale: -3 = Treason, -2 = Awful, -1 = Poor, 0 = Normal, +1 = Good, +2 = Great, +3 = Blood! Why Aren't the titles used anywhere?

I have no idea why they removed negative luck- after all, all previous games had it. The titles for luck/morale levels were also used in H2 (I don't recall if they were in H1, but I think so). The only reason I can think of for this is that they put those in before they decided to have 3 (7?) level of each, and they never bothered to attach the titles.
[*]Unused spell effects. In H3Bitmap, you can see alternative versions of Fireball, Frost Ring etc. Why weren't they used randomly or removed before release?

For all you "why not removed" comments, it is often very hard to remove pieces of data. Also, they may have been debating about using some of them, and it really wasn't worth the effort to delete the individual sounds from the LOD.
[*]Magic Mirror is called "Backlash" internally (Heroes3.snd). Similarly, Dread Knights are called "Black Lords", Implosion is called "Decay" (in fact, even the sprite resembles decay more than implosion), Inferno is called "Fire Blast", Armageddon is called "Firestorm", Ice Bold is called "Ice Ray", Slow is called "Muck Mire", Destroy Undead is called "Sacred Breath", Haste is called "Tail wind", Stone Skin is called "Tough Skin".

A number of these sound like the names used in the M&M games. In any event, changing the file names for the sounds would mean needing to change the references in the code- and if they missed one, it might cause problems. From the user end, it makes do difference, so why risk breaking the code?
[*]Centaurs have a shooting sound. Interesting thing is that it's the same one that was used in HoMM4! Efreeti Sultans, Harpy Hags, Manticores, Scorpicores, Minotaur Kings, War Unicorns and Dragonflies also have a shooting sound.

Some of those (such as centaurs) also have shooting animations. Basically, these are units that were origianlly going to have ranged attack ability, but then that was removed. The centaur shooting animation is used in WoG, btw.
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Postby Mirez » Aug 4 2010, 15:01

negative luck sucks imo
treants are dendrosexual 0_o

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Postby GreatEmerald » Aug 4 2010, 15:33

Mirez, any reason for that? In HoMM4 it worked just fine (although it has a reverse effect). Haven't played earlier HoMM games, so can't tell about those... Without negative luck, Misfortune is quite a useless spell.

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Postby Qurqirish Dragon » Aug 5 2010, 12:54

In point of fact, before playing H4, I only had bad luck occur ONCE ever. There were simply too many ways to combat bad luck. Of course, that stormcloud animation is therefore probably the least known one in the series!
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Postby Vlaad II » Aug 6 2010, 1:01

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Postby Pol » Aug 6 2010, 4:52

GreatEmerald wrote:Mirez, any reason for that? In HoMM4 it worked just fine (although it has a reverse effect). Haven't played earlier HoMM games, so can't tell about those... Without negative luck, Misfortune is quite a useless spell.

As far as I know it was disbalancing game too much, thus JVC ordered to remove it. And In RoE you could encounter it very, very, very randomly - if you didn't patched. That was just 1:1 000 000 chance! :D
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