Scarlett Thread

Maps and the art of mapmaking.
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ScarlettP
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Scarlett Thread

Unread postby ScarlettP » 16 Jan 2006, 12:37

Ok, it's back.

I'm finally getting around to finishing Season of War - the monster that I started over 2 years ago. I've learned a lot over the passing of time and have fixed most of the things that testers pointed out. One major complaint was about the quest huts not working correctly. I've got most of them fixed, but one is acting rather strangely and I don't know how to FIX it. Simplified version as follows.

Quest Hut:

Requirement - Hero must enter alone.
Number of Heroes = 1 AND Total Number of Creatures = 0

Completion Script - Display Message: "It's an ambush."
Combat: This army fights full set of berzerkers & 1 stack Frenzied Gnasher (numbers not specified)

Branch:
Victoriouse - Display Message: "You win." 2nd action Give Artifact
Loose - Display Message: "They drag your body away."


OK! This sounded easy enough. I'm testing on Intermediate level as I'm NOT a good fighter. The default creature numbers turned out to be about 250 Berzerkers and 6 Frenzied Gnashers against my one level 22 Life General (Max for the map is 22). First time I tried it, I lost. Not surprising. Noticed something odd - My 'dead' hero did not turn into the yellow circle with a colored flag that normally marks a dead hero. He turned into that 'hidden' treasure pile.

I didn't think much of it, just reloaded the game and took my Hero around to 'beef him up' a bit more by visiting shrines & stuff to increase attack & defence & load him up with Immortality Potions. Went back and won in a fair fight. STILL got the "Drag your body away" message and no Reward.

Curious, I reloaded and deliberatly lost. He turned into the 'treasure' pile again. I sent a creature over to pick up the 'treasure' pile, got the hero's tombstone but the 'treasure' pile remained. I took the tombstone back to the nearest castle and 'revived' him, as expected, he now had ZERO artifacts.

Any ideas about what I'm doing wrong on my branches? Why don't I get my "victory" message & prize?

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Ururam Tururam
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Re: Scarlett Thread

Unread postby Ururam Tururam » 16 Jan 2006, 14:03

ScarlettP wrote:I'm finally getting around to finishing Season of War - the monster that I started over 2 years ago.
I wish you finish before the release of Heroes V!
Hoc est opus!
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Unread postby wimfrits » 16 Jan 2006, 14:30

The combat script is bugged. There are different workarounds, but I forgot which exactly. There was a detailed discussion on the subject on the old RT.

Myself, I use a ghost-script to work around this problem. Downside is that if the hero dies, there will be a ghost in the army. Script is based on the fact that a dead hero counts as 1 and you cannot remove the last creature in an army.
After the fight :

IF number of heroes in army = ZERO
- - ---> hero has fled
ELSE
- - GIVE 1 ghost to this army
- - TAKE 1 ghost from this army
- - IF number of ghosts in army = ZERO
- - - - ---> hero was victorious
- - ELSE
- - - - ---> hero was defeated
- - END-IF
END-IF

There's an example of the above script somewhere in the triggered script tab of quest hut 'Golem Arena' in the purple subterranean part of map 'The Frog' in 'a Wind of Thorns v2.0'
Are you suggesting coconuts migrate?

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Unread postby Crusard » 16 Jan 2006, 16:32

And if your hero is Unique, you can set the scripts in the Defeated and Victorious parts.

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Unread postby wimfrits » 16 Jan 2006, 21:13

.
And if your hero is Unique, you can set the scripts in the Defeated and Victorious parts.
That doesn't differentiate between fleeing and defeat, or does it?

With a body being dragged away I think that's an essential difference
Are you suggesting coconuts migrate?

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Re: Scarlett Thread

Unread postby ScarlettP » 17 Jan 2006, 01:19

Ururam Tururam wrote:
I wish you finish before the release of Heroes V!
Yeah... that was what I was hoping for... to FINALLY finish it while people still wanted to play H4.

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Unread postby ScarlettP » 17 Jan 2006, 01:26

Wimfrits, I had to read that script about 5 times to figure out where you were going with that idea. I think I understand...

the "Hero has Fled" option is incase you notice you're about to loose and flee. (I hadn't even thought of that option! I'll have to write a new 'branch'.)

Then the "Hero Victory/Defeat" options would be my "Get Reward" or "Drag your body away" actions.

I take it that these options would be in a "Sequence" box instead of being in the Combat box?

(I'm just trying to do SOMETHING different in a Quest hut other than bringing creatures, materials or artifacts.)

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Unread postby wimfrits » 17 Jan 2006, 07:49

ScarlettP wrote:the "Hero has Fled" option is incase you notice you're about to loose and flee. (I hadn't even thought of that option! I'll have to write a new 'branch'.)

Then the "Hero Victory/Defeat" options would be my "Get Reward" or "Drag your body away" actions.

I take it that these options would be in a "Sequence" box instead of being in the Combat box?
Yes to all.
(I'm just trying to do SOMETHING different in a Quest hut other than bringing creatures, materials or artifacts.)
That's always a good thing!
Are you suggesting coconuts migrate?

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Unread postby Ururam Tururam » 17 Jan 2006, 08:03

ScarlettP wrote:(I'm just trying to do SOMETHING different in a Quest hut other than bringing creatures, materials or artifacts.)
:D I guess you make something like the golemmaker hut from "THe Frog" by Wimfrits or like my gladiators encampment from "Around the Calendar".

My favorite creation of a quest hut was the Baldang's Tomb from "The tale of the Dread Castle". I'm still getting emails with questions how to solve this! :) This is the way to get more feedback from players...
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Unread postby ScarlettP » 17 Jan 2006, 13:34

Yeah... I'm trying. I'm just not as good at it as you guys are.

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Unread postby ScarlettP » 17 Jan 2006, 14:04

Guess I'll have to put a Halberd of the Swiftwatch on the next map so I can have it. The hero is already maxed out, so the battle won't make any diff in the game play. I'll get the hut to work on a small test map and then replace it. The Halberd is a carry over item - because it's my personal fave! I'm NOT going to restart this map AGAIN! Gees! That's another reason I stopped working on it... I couldn't stand to just Keep PLAYING it over and Over and OVER! BLECK!!!

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Unread postby wimfrits » 17 Jan 2006, 15:27

ScarlettP wrote:That's another reason I stopped working on it... I couldn't stand to just Keep PLAYING it over and Over and OVER! BLECK!!!
For functional and technical test I usually either use:
- a scout hero (I have this GM scouting GM stealth scout hero equipped with viewing artifacts as a custom object in the custom object palette to drag-and-drop on the map).
- when specifc heroes are required: temporary test-portals to quickly get the heroes where they need to go.
Are you suggesting coconuts migrate?

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Unread postby Ururam Tururam » 17 Jan 2006, 16:18

To test campaigns and large maps I often use a "dubler" - a hero of the same name that the expected one. I put him near the place I want to test.
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Unread postby Robenhagen » 17 Jan 2006, 16:25

wimfrits wrote:- when specifc heroes are required: temporary test-portals to quickly get the heroes where they need to go.
I use a similar thing in my map (which was suppose to be finished for the Equilibris contest last year :applause: ); an enabled cheat function. I use teleporters to go where I need to be and scripts to set the variables that should have been set, and hand over artifacts missed + a small boost equal to what was missed in the part that was skipped. This allows me to test balance as well as scripts at any point of the map, it does require some extra work, but it's really quite handy.
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Unread postby Thelonious » 17 Jan 2006, 19:12

ScarlettP wrote:Yeah... I'm trying. I'm just not as good at it as you guys are.
Neither am I, but with their help you can get a long way :D
Grah!

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Unread postby ScarlettP » 19 Jan 2006, 01:31

Aside from the one quest hut with a bad 'combat' script in it, everything on Maps 1 & 2 seem to be working. The End Gate is still a bit freaky in the way the Trigger, Proposal, ect. messages work, but I don't see anyway to avoid that sort of thing because the Triggered Script area does not allow "If/Then" statements. I'll try Wimfrit's suggestion on a small test map for the quest hut and move on to Map 3. I don't think anyone ever found any major malfunctions with that one... just the usual complaints that the battle are to easy. Last time I 'stepped up' the creature stacks, I could bearly finish the thing. Maybe that will be enough to keep people from bitching to loudly. (Ghod knows they will NEVER be happy!)

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Unread postby Veldrynus » 19 Jan 2006, 07:04

I'd really like to finaly see the campaign. I am included :proud: ... right? :| . Unfortunately, my H4 CD-s seem to be missing.

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Unread postby ScarlettP » 19 Jan 2006, 13:36

Of course you're in it Vel! You're the big bad ass at the end! Kalah wrote this really nice poem to hint that you're the one.

Life is his bane,
Endless his reign.
Violent, his rule.

Young is his enemy
- experience she lacks
Danger awaits, she cannot see
Reluctant to face the facts.

Scornful and daring,
Unafraid and uncaring,
None other so cruel.

See the first letter of each line? LEVYDRSUN - VELDRYNUS

Kalah & I had a long running battle over the poems. I wanted traditional American, Iambic Pentameter rythums and rhymes at the end. Kalah convenced me that some of the more Nortic ballad styles would work better in places. And since KALAH is the name of the Oracle that is delivering these poems, I relented.

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Unread postby Thelonious » 19 Jan 2006, 13:44

It's a shame I don't have the expansion - I'd love to play test the campaign!
Grah!

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Unread postby ScarlettP » 19 Jan 2006, 13:50

I sent Kalah a copy of WOW last year so that he could play it. I can't really afford to send them to everyone. ;)

Oh! And I did finish Map 2. Ethric is a MUCH better opponant now. I beefed up his Attack, Defence & Speed and gave him some more artifacts. Doesn't matter how many spells he knows, if you can take him out in ONE shot, it's just NO FUN!

Still got to re-write that quest hut. Will try to get to that tonight.

(I've got a convention this weekend, so I haven't had as much time on the computer as I would like.)


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