Heroes 3 fan-made balance patch (mod) updated!

The old Heroes games developed by New World Computing. Please specify which game you are referring to in your post.

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DissidentPLM
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Newbie Question

Postby DissidentPLM » Jul 26 2011, 13:22

In order to start the game using this mod, do you use the turretfix exe or the normal exe? Thank you in advance.

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Postby UndeadHalfOrc » Jul 26 2011, 18:15

the turret fix exe

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Postby kyrub » Jul 29 2011, 18:27

Just a quick note: the change I suggested is still WIP, since my worktime has blown anything else away.

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Postby UndeadHalfOrc » Jul 30 2011, 12:49

Take your time because I start a new job on monday and will probably won't have much free time myself

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Postby pikeman93 » Sep 15 2011, 20:12

Love the patch so far! Better than WoG and all those unnecessary commanders. Thanks UHO!

However, I kind of feel that you overnerfed the phoenixes. High growth were their speciality, but now they grow just as much as any other level 7's. Now they're just slightly better ghost dragons with much more speed.

I think a better way to balance them would be this:

Initial growth - 1 per week
Citadel - 2 per week
Castle - 3 per week

and remove the +30 HP

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Postby UndeadHalfOrc » Sep 16 2011, 2:21

Thanks for your comments! Glad you enjoy it.
I think Phoenixes are WAY ahead of Ghost Dragons, especially with the extra 30 HP - they're the fastest units around, are immune to Armageddon and all fire spells, AND they have their awesome rebirth ability.

I don't think it's possible to have a growth of 1-2-3. I can only change the base growth and the game multiplies that by 1.5 for citadel (rounded down) and 2.0 for castle.


In other news...

Someone reported a problem that he could not get the AB features (ie: conflux town) using my patch. Here's a cut and paste of my solution to him, hopefully it should fix the problem for everybody...

The patch is based on the Heroes 3 Shadow of Death executable, whish only enables Conflux if the required Armageddon's Blade files are all in the Data folder.

It only checks if those files exist by those names, not the contents, so just create bogus .txt files and rename them accordingly:

H3ab_ahd.snd
H3ab_ahd.vid
H3ab_bmp.lod
H3ab_spr.lod
H3abp_bm.lod
H3abp_sp.lod

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Postby Aenain » Sep 16 2011, 14:34

Hi UndeadHalfOrc,

Thank you and congratulations for doing this patch. I want to try it, although at first sight there are some changes I don't like. I think the changes to the artifacts' properties are nice and have just started using that file.

Logistics and Offense are probably overpowered compared to other skills, but nerfing them doesn't seem appealing to me. I like my heroes travelling fast too much :) I agree that Intelligence increases spell points too much, but on the other hand I hardly ever feel the need to take that skill. Also, isn't 10 squares for Expert Scouting a lot ?

The one skill that I would really like to see improved is Eagle Eye. I remember someone suggesting a long time ago that Eagle Eye should :
- allow heroes to learn the spell immediately after it was cast, not at the end of the fight
- work with adventure map spells (if an enemy hero casts one those spells within your line of sight, I guess)

Furthermore, I would keep the 40% / 50% / 60% percentages (because at 85% / 85% / 85% , the Eagle Eye speciality, for the heroes who have it, already gives 100% at level 4). However, Eagle Eye should have another additionnal, new feature. For instance, it could give a chance (less than the previous percentages) to cast a beneficial spell of your choice (levels 1-2 / 3 / 4 at Basic/Advanced/Expert) at the beginning of a fight if your hero gets attacked, but not if you are the attacker. This would add a real value to the skill. What do you think of this idea ?

The only problem is of course, how do we modify the executable to add this ^^ Kyrub, I was wondering how you managed to do your modifications ? Did you disassemble the game ? Which software did you use ?

I don't know what to think of all the small changes to the creatures and costs, but you seem to have put a lot of work into it. In fact I think the game is already well balanced without any mods, except for a few things like the Phoenixes and damage spells not being strong enough. The discussion about the mass versions of spells in this thread is very interesting, by the way.

I often wish you could cast two spells per battle round. Has anyone felt the same ?

UndeadHalfOrc, could you give the offsets for the secondary skills percentages ? (I am already using the no-cd v4.0 EXE with the defence tower and sound fixes.)

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Postby UndeadHalfOrc » Sep 17 2011, 1:44

>>> but nerfing them doesn't seem appealing to me. I like my heroes travelling fast too much


If you can't live without it, that means you find heroes that weren't offered the skill not viable. THAT is the very definition of an overpowered skill. You should be able to play the game normally, without too much disadvantage, by not getting the pick.


Sure, here are the offsets. But I warn you, it's a complete pain in the ass to convert percentages to/from hexadecimal.

Here are the offsets along with some of the commonly used percent values that I wrote down.

offset: 0x0023e998(luck)
offset: 0x0023e9a8(leadership)
offset: 0x0023e9b8(necromancy)
offset: 0x0023e9c8(mysticism)
offset: 0x0023e9d8(scouting)
offset: 0x0023e9e8(archery)
offset: 0x0023e9f8(offence)
offset: 0x0023ea08(armorer)
offset: 0x0023ea18(estates)
offset: 0x0023ea28(eagle eye)
offset: 0x0023ea38(diplomacy)
offset: 0x0023ea48(resistance)
offset: 0x0023ea58(learning)
offset: 0x0023ea68(logistics)
offset: 0x0023ea78(sorcery)
offset: 0x0023ea88(intelligence)
offset: 0x0023ea98(first aid)


Some Percentages:
05% - CD CC 4C 3D
07% - 29 5C 8F 3D
0.0833333333 - AB AA AA 3D
10% - CD CC CC 3D
14% - 29 5C 0F 3E
15% - 9A 99 19 3E
0.1666666667 - AB AA 2A 3E
18% - EC 51 38 3E
20% - CD CC 4C 3E
25% - 00 00 80 3E
30% - 9A 99 99 3E
40% - CD CC CC 3E
45% - 67 66 E6 3E
60% - 9A 99 19 3F

Here's a site that converts values.
http://babbage.cs.qc.edu/IEEE-754/Decimal.html

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to UHA and kyrub

Postby iliecostin » Sep 18 2012, 8:24

Did u guys ever get to finish a mod that has the spell pow -creature lvl implemented? I really love UHA's work and ive been playing your modded version for a half year on hot seat and we love it. On the matter of conflux nerf maybe someone can change the prereq for upg. lvl 1 to castle building since the overpowered thing is the verry good start with them since the have no retal. I have also took the liberty to chance Phoenix/Firebird growth back to 2/2 and dropped damage on both to 20-30 and life to 110/130, cost 1250/ 2250 +1Merc. I still did exceptionally well on hot seat , i just lost a lot of them during big battles. Also do UHA or kyrub know how to change the Arch Devil special from -1 luck to Fearsome ;). I would be eternally grateful.

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Postby SkeleTony » Oct 1 2012, 1:40

WOG is still crap though IMO. I realize it was a lot of work and all but those allegedly optional changes...almost none of them are well thought out or well executed. I often call WOG the 'Duct tape and chicken wire' mod because it is so full of messy kludges to try and achieve things the game does not need, such as units over 7th level (aside from the official Rust/Azure/Fairy/Crystal dragons and such) and the names of every one of these silly units are just horrible! "Ghost behemoth"?! WHY?! Makes no sense and I can think of a dozen more appropriate names for such a unit (i.e. "Gargantuan (Behemoth)"). Same goes for "Blood Dragons" and the rest.

Also, even ignoring whether one likes WOG or not I remember trying t6o uninstall WOG after I tried my damnde4st to find some value in it but the regular Heroes III install was screwed up after that and I had to uninstall and re-install the game because Tavern Rumors and such were all giving WOG-ified messages and crap.

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Postby themaster » Oct 4 2012, 12:45

Having tried your mod with the campaigns.. it does make the game harder.. but not hard enough!

Probably what I was looking for.. :P

I'm sure your aware.. that every time a video comes up in the campaign there's a 3fx error or something like that.. and the video doesn't play.. (also weirdly and I assumed maybe you had to complete a campaign as "armageddon's blade" never shows up from your executable vs. h3 complete)

For some reason in my life every time I started heroes4 within 5 seconds.. I quit and never played it again! :P

Now that I see it's like a "age of wonders" version of heroes.. I may give it a try.. at least try to make it into a few levels/maps of the campaign.. even though it's from 2002 and the new x-com just came out :P

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Postby fxalexei » Nov 2 2012, 15:08

Nice job man ! it's true that all this game need is a little balacing to be perfect :p

This is the changes I'd make if it depended on me ( and If I had skill in programing haha )

Skills : - Sorcery : from 5%,10%,15% to 10%,20%,30%
- Mysticism ( utter crap as it is if you ask me ) : from +1,+2,+3 to
+ 10%,+20%,+30% of the mana pool .
I think this would really make those skills useful for magic heroes and kinda close the gap existing between might and magic heroes atm
- Resistance : from 5%,10%,20% to 10%,20%,30%
- Learning: from 5%,10%,15% to 10%,20%,30%
- Necromancy : from 10%,20%,30% to 5%,10%,15%
Also fix the damn armored tower bug ;) it's so annoying !

Magic: Air : - fix the air shield tower bug
- Magic mirror : basic 20%, advanced 30 % , expert mass effect 30%
Fire : - increase fireball/inferno damage
- Slayer mechanics should be changed. In my opinion making it work like the Offense skill instead of giving bonus to attack stats should be good. Something like
basic +20% damage output vs level 7, advanced +30% and expert mass effect
- Fireshield expert : mass effect
Earth : Increase Death ripple damage

Now for the different Factions :

Castle : none

Rampart : Dendroid guard gold cost increased from 350 to 375

Tower : Stone gargoyle gold cost decreased from 130 to 120
Obsidian gargoyle gold cost decreased from 160 to 140

Inferno : Imp gold cost decreased from 50 to 30
Familiar gold cost decreased from 60 to 40
Magog damage increased from 2-4 to 3-4
Magog health increased from 13 to 14
Magog defense increased from 4 to 5
gog growth increased from 8 to 9
Magog gold cost decreased from 175 to 160
Hell Hound growth increased from 5 to 6
Pit lord gold cost decreased from 700 to 600
Pit lord attack/defense increased from 13/13 to 14/14

Necropolis : Skeleton gold cost decreased from 60 to 50
Skeleton Warrior gold cost decreased from 70 to 60
Zombie health point increased from 15 to 20
Walking dead attack/defense skill increased from 5/5 to 6/6
Walking dead health point increased from 20 to 25
Walking dead growth increased from 8 to 9
Wight gold cost decreased from 200 to 190
Wight/Wraith Health point increased from 18 to 20
Wight speed increased from 5 to 6
Wraith attack/defense skill increased from 7/7 to 8/8
Wraith speed increased from 7 to 8
Wraith gold cost decreased from 230 to 210
Bone dragon defense increased from 15 to 17
Ghost dragon Attack/defense increased from 19/17 to 20/20
Ghost dragon health point increased from 200 to 220
Necromancy Amplifier bonus from 10% to 5%

Dungeon : Infernal Trogolodyte gold cost decreased from 65 to 60
Beholder gold cost decreased from 250 to 240
Evil eyes gold cost decreased from 280 to 260
Scorpicore damage increased from 14-20 to 16-20

Stronghold : Goblin gold cost decreased from 40 to 35
Hobgoblin gold cost decreased from 50 to 45
Wolf raider/rider health increased from 10 to 12
Cyclops cave cost changed from 2000 gold 20 crystals 20 ore to 2000 gold 10 cystals 10 mercury 10 ore
Cyclops gold cost increased from 750 to 800
Cyclops king gold cost decreased from 1100 to 1000

Fortress: Upgraded Gnoll hut wood cost decreased from 10 to 5
Gnoll health point increased from 6 to 7
Gnoll gold cost increased from 50 to 55
Gnoll Marauder defense increased from 6 to 7
Gnoll Marauder health point increased from 6 to 8
Serpent fly gold cost decreased from 220 to 210
Dragon fly gold cost decreased from 240 to 230
Hydra speed increased from 5 to 6
Hydra attack/defense increased from 16/18 to 16/19
Chaos hydra attack/defense increased from 18/20 to 18/22
Chaos hydra speed increased from 7 to 8

I don't have enough knowledge about the conflux to make any comment since I never play with them ( totally overcheated if you ask ^^ )

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Postby Artas1984 » Jan 7 2013, 19:54

UHO, spare me the readings - what is the turret fix?

And i mean lol - naming it H3MOD - sounds very original does not it? :D
Heroes franchise was not about the free actions of Heroes or monsters, it was not about 3D of shiny graphics either, it was about diversity and balance, simplicity of gameplay and realistic picture, strategy in it's purest form. That's why Heroes 3 will be the greatest game of all, because only Heroes 3 has all those qualities together, no matter which one you personally like more. This statement is unquestionable, uncriticized and undeniable .

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Postby explicite » Jan 16 2013, 19:31

Hi, how do I go about using this balance patch with the HoMM3 HD mod?

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Postby juderiverman » Jan 25 2013, 3:18

explicite wrote:Hi, how do I go about using this balance patch with the HoMM3 HD mod?


is there anyone showing up to combine these two good mods, HD and Balance?

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Postby hommthree » Sep 9 2013, 19:08

To preface, I almost exclusively play HoMM3 against the AI, but I've played it for, easily, hundreds of hours. I also haven't actually tested the patch, just read the patch notes. It's also been about a year since I've played it. I'm waiting for the game to complete downloading as I write.

There are four spells I'd like to address, starting with Resurrection, and its undead counterpart, Animate dead; as well as the 3 heroes that start with the spells.

They seem inherently unbalanced. With resurrection, the creatures resurrected will not "stay alive" after the fight without advanced/expert earth magic. Note that this does NOT apply to Animate Dead.
The root problem with these spells is, at the end of a fight where you lost a lot of creatures, you can blind the last enemy creature, then bring all your creatures to life, causing you to lose nothing but spell points from the fight, which are easily recovered via magic well or a stay at a town.

This causes my macro starting tactic to basically be this: on small maps, go undead using the starting hero with animate dead as his specialty, so you can quickly plow through monsters and rush your enemy. On large maps, go with dungeon, (which has the only two heroes specializing in resurrection) and pray to the HoMM gods for advanced Earth Magic as early as possible, so I can use whatever creatures are available to me. My recommendation is to either remove these spells entirely, or make them automatically available to heroes with the appropriate Wisdom level.


Which brings me to my next spell: advanced/expert town portal, which allows your hero to instantly teleport to any friendly town of their choice, for a mere 16 spell points and a few movement points. This makes hero diversity practically pointless, and completely crushes your opponents hope at offensive strategy. You can leave every town undefended and just stack creatures on your town portal hero, and when you see an enemy hero approaching any of your towns, you can teleport there for a trivial cost when it may otherwise take you 20 turns to get there. The novice/basic levels of the spell don't share this problem, as they simply teleport you to the nearest friendly town. My recommendation is to allow the caster to choose any town within a set radius, even at novice/basic, and increase that radius with their Earth Magic level.

The last spell is Blind, and the main problem with it is that it's inclusive to any spellcaster, and advanced/expert fire magic don't improve it enough. Why would you want to break a blind with effreti (misspelled I know) when you could use archdevils, anyway? Blind, like Slow, Haste, and Dispel, is a staple spell for any hero, it's one of the best spells in the game, and Expert Fire Magic should give it an appropriate kick. My recommendation is, in addition to its other effects, Expert Blind should weaken the enemy after it's broken, like a reverse-Prayer.

Lastly, regarding skill selection, I believe the hero should be able to choose between 4 skills at level up: a might skill, a magic skill, a mobility/other skill, or a skill based on what hero type they are (might or magic)

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Postby Salamandre » Sep 9 2013, 19:23

Instead of removing this or that because the game is too easy with, why not give the appropriate bonuses to AI so it can compete with your best play skill?

Such mods are available for era (wog), see conquistador. If you can win that mod on expert, you will never play regular AI again.

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Postby hommthree » Sep 9 2013, 20:12

Salamandre wrote:Instead of removing this or that because the game is too easy with, why not give the appropriate bonuses to AI so it can compete with your best play skill?

Such mods are available for era (wog), see conquistador. If you can win that mod on expert, you will never play regular AI again.

Thanks for pointing me towards WoG, gonna try that ASAP. Will there be any compatibility issues with the mod posted in this thread and WoG?
Sorry if these are old questions, I'm new to HoMM3 modding and game modding in general.

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Postby Salamandre » Sep 9 2013, 20:22

No, they are not compatible. WoG is stand alone and latest version (era) can be dloaded here:

http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=37208

If you prefer vanilla game to wog modifications, start with SoD mod then add what you like to it.

Era mods:
http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=39062

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Postby hommthree » Sep 9 2013, 20:46

Salamandre wrote:No, they are not compatible. WoG is stand alone and latest version (era) can be dloaded here:

http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=37208

If you prefer vanilla game to wog modifications, start with SoD mod then add what you like to it.

Era mods:
http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=39062

Thanks, but this is just too much. All I want is a way to modify or remove spells/heroes en masse (applied to every map, while the default map editor just allows for one map edited at a time). Aside from that I think the patch in this thread fixes most of the issues with the game.

Also: I can't get the patch from this thread to work with HoMM3 Complete. I put H3_turretfix.exe in my "Heroes of Might and Magic III Complete" folder (same folder the base .exe file for launching the game is in,) and put the .txt files in "Downloads\Heroes of Might and Magic III Complete\Data", and when that didn't work, moved them to "Heroes of Might and Magic III Complete\Heroes3\Data". Can't get it to work.

Like I said, I'm new to game modding in general, so I'm sure the problem is on my end. Any help would be appreciated.


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