"Stealth" surrendering? News to me...

The old Heroes games developed by New World Computing. Please specify which game you are referring to in your post.
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difool
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"Stealth" surrendering? News to me...

Unread postby difool » 01 Apr 2008, 23:33

Someone alluded to this odd alleged "feature" in the following thread:

http://www.celestialheavens.com/forums/ ... php?t=8448

Basically the supposition is that, when an AI hero "retreats" in H2/H3 (not sure about H4), he actually gets to keep his army (at the moment of the "retreat") for free. I've never noticed this at all, over hundreds of H2/H3 games-when the hero in question shows up again he doesn't have his defeated army with him, but troops he bought from the town he was rehired from. IOW I don't buy it.

Now in H2 I have seen heroes show up in my tavern with lots of troops, I would guess from when their faction got wiped out after the 7 day no-town timer expired, but not in H3 where all troops are reset to default values in that situation. I will go off and test this of course but don't expect to find it.

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UndeadHalfOrc
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Re: "Stealth" surrendering? News to me...

Unread postby UndeadHalfOrc » 02 Apr 2008, 00:06

It never happened to me neither as far as I could see,
difool wrote: Now in H2 I have seen heroes show up in my tavern with lots of troops, I would guess from when their faction got wiped out after the 7 day no-town timer expired
Really? This never happened to me. Have a savegame handy?

I will have to create a test map just to test this out, else I will have nightmares.

The best way is to give the AI hero tons of nice artifacts, and a unique (and slow, defensive) creature stack (that he cannot get more more of in his town - say a mummy stack) and make sure it survives at all times.
Make sure his only town is within sight at all times.
Then attack this hero with a superior army.

When it retreats and rehires, watch to see if the mummy is still present.

I will do this later on.

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UndeadHalfOrc
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Unread postby UndeadHalfOrc » 02 Apr 2008, 20:26

difool, it appears we can sleep safe and sound, no such stealth surrendering appeared in all my tests, even on impossible levels.

Here are the test maps I used. They are very similar. In both, the AI hero is given artifacts, and special neutral units. Those neutral units never reappear when the AI re-hires the hero on turn 2.

Heroes 2 test map
http://pages.infinit.net/plague/ZAIfullr.MX2

Heroes 3 test map
http://pages.infinit.net/plague/z_ai_full_recruit.h3m

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Ya5MieL
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Unread postby Ya5MieL » 02 Apr 2008, 21:29

You should not pay much notice to random ramblings on April the first. Didn't thought it would actually lead to some people testing it, i was just fooling that guy in other thread...

:P

Sleep well!

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UndeadHalfOrc
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Unread postby UndeadHalfOrc » 02 Apr 2008, 22:37

:tired:

To make this testing of mine feel even more pointless, I could have just simply pointed out that an annoying, powerful enemy hero is ALWAYS defeated when you corner him in a castle. You are allowed to surrender in castles, but not retreat. That fact alone was proof that the AI does use the "retreat" button and not surrender. (Exception made for Heroes 3's barbarian castle)

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Metathron
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Unread postby Metathron » 03 Apr 2008, 15:13

How should we punish Ya5miel?

I suggest death by tickling.
Jesus saves, Allah forgives, Cthulhu thinks you'd make a nice sandwich.


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