Question about WOG

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Metathron
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Question about WOG

Postby Metathron » Jun 14 2009, 14:02

I have decided to reinstall HoMM III complete with the intention of playing the campaigns (never finished them) and single scenarios. I've also been toying with the idea of installing WoG, which I never really experienced. Is this a good idea? Does WoG enhance the game gently like Equilibris does HoMM IV, or is it a major overhaul, and one should play the game(s) fully before tampering with WoG?
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Yes

Postby Acron » Jun 14 2009, 20:54

WoG does add many features, but almost all of them are optional. It is also recommended that you install WoG in a copied folder of Homm, so that the original is still intact and playable.

Note: I seem to recall that even if they are in separate folders the original will be slightly altered graphically; with moving trees, new resource icons etc. But I might be mistaken.
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Postby ByteBandit » Jun 14 2009, 21:16

WoG is not at all like Equilibrus. You can do 20 times more with WoG than you can with Equilibrus. It can either change the game a little, or change the game into a whole new gaming experience for H3. It's up to you. But remember, the more you select the more unstable the game could play. Keep your global selections to a minimum, but experiment with all the options and find out which ones you may like best to play.
At first, I selected mass options, and the AI couldn't decide how to play its position. The less options I selected, the more smoothly the game played. WoG is so disversified, the game could collapse in on itself. So don't select every option you can get your hands on. And you should be alright. If you Don't have WoG, I strongly recommend you get it anyway, despite the negativity I just gave you. I'm just giving you the worst case scenario on WoG. Overall, it's still the best thing going for any Heroes game out there.

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Re: Question about WOG

Postby Psyringe » Jun 16 2009, 10:28

Metathron wrote:Is this a good idea? Does WoG enhance the game gently like Equilibris does HoMM IV, or is it a major overhaul, and one should play the game(s) fully before tampering with WoG?

WoG is what keeps me playing HoMM3, it's a great addition to an already very good game. WoG can be fine-tuned to change very little or quite a lot, from interface improvements to radical changes about how the game plays. However, it takes a bit of work to find one's way through all its options, there's a learning curve involved and the documentation, while generally good, isn't perfect. If you enjoy tinkering, and if it doesn't bother you to spend some days getting acquainted with WoG before starting on the campaigns, then I recommend using it. If you don't want the risk that some of the options mess up the campaign you're playing, then don't use it now, but keep it in mind for later.
Some things to look out for when using WoG on the original campaigns:

1. When WoGifying campaign maps, be careful about replacing objects, this can mess up the balance of the campaign. Also, I recommend not to activate some of the more drastic changes, for the same reason. Finally, there's a small risk that WoGifying a map will break the campaign and you have to use cheat codes to advance. It happened to me only twice in about 40 maps, so it may not happen to you at all, but one should know that the risk is there.

2. When setting WoG options, keep in mind that the *hardcoded* options (those from the first option page) will take effect no matter whether or not you WoGify the map. This means, for example, if you activated commanders in the options, then they will be present, even if you don't WoGify the map. This means that your high-level hero, when taken to the next map, will bring his high-level commander with him, who can sometimes single-handedly kill everything in the vicinity.

To fully enjoy WoG, I recommend to play two or three quick test games before embarking on an XL map or a whole campaign. You really need to get acquainted with the options before using them, otherwise the chances for undesired effects are definitely there, and you don't want to realize that you should've chosen other options when you're already in the middle of a difficult campaign. Many options *have* to be playtested before one can understand their impact on the game, there are some side effects that aren't all that obvious.

One great feature of WoG is that you can save the option setup to different profiles. Personally, I have one profile for random maps, one for maps created specifically for WoG, and one for the original campaign maps. The latter profile has only minimal changes, but it does retain the interface improvements that I've come to like. I'm pretty satisfied with this setup, and regularly use WoG on the original maps, but as I said, it takes a bit of work to arrive at a setup that suits your taste and doesn't have undesired effects.

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Postby Metathron » Jun 18 2009, 12:28

Thanks for your thoughtful replies, you guys.

I think I'll steer clear of WoG, at least for the time being. Sounds rather intimidating! 8|
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Postby Storm-giant » Jun 19 2009, 14:20

As ByteBandit says, do not try all options at the same time(crash for sure). Try several options(for ex, first the commanders, later stack experience, etc...). There are some options that balance the game(like secondary skill boosts).
Oh, btw, WoG has the nice feature of tweaking the Uber imba grail(Aurora Borealias).Now it only gives the spells you could normally learn(if no wisdom->only level 1&2 spells learn!) and it no longers gives the cheating Titans Thunder's spell :-D
And be open minded, WoG can either keep the original gameplay or change radically. You decide ;)
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Postby obelisk v2.0 » Jun 24 2009, 21:11

Storm-giant wrote: it no longers gives the cheating Titans Thunder's spell :-D


I admit, it's been a while since I last played WoG and might not remember some details, but I fail to see exactly *how* does Titan's Thunder classify as cheating? The spell is useless... :D

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Postby Midas » Aug 29 2009, 15:53

I posted a topic about what WoG features... please reply to that
I'm desperate to know :-D
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Postby Zamolxis » Aug 29 2009, 16:39

Metathron wrote:I think I'll steer clear of WoG, at least for the time being. Sounds rather intimidating! 8|

If you can enjoy H3 as it is, then there's indeed no need to install WoG. I remember enjoying the original H3 for almost 5 years before I discovered WoG - which came in the right moment, namely when I started to get a little bored with some parts of the game.

If on the other hand, after playing only like half of a campaign, you start to get annoyed by weak skills obtained against your will at Witch Huts, lame hero specialties, or if for any other reason something bores you about it, then by all means try WoG, which takes the game to a whole new level. The only risk, as mentioned above, is the fact that it gives you the possibility to change the game balance in both directions, from tweaking the skills to the point that all become equally valuable, to the point that you can get huge advantages over the AI.

But, as I said, I think it's best to first fully enjoy the original H3 before moving to WoG (otherwise there's even the risk that you won't fully appreciate what it has to offer). ;)
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Postby darknessfood » Aug 30 2009, 0:28

Zamolxis wrote:
Metathron wrote:I think I'll steer clear of WoG, at least for the time being. Sounds rather intimidating! 8|

If you can enjoy H3 as it is, then there's indeed no need to install WoG. I remember enjoying the original H3 for almost 5 years before I discovered WoG - which came in the right moment, namely when I started to get a little bored with some parts of the game.



How about moving trees! I use WoG for that :P...
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Postby GreatEmerald » Aug 30 2009, 9:34

Yeap, I use WoG for moving trees and enhancements like hero regrouping and additional info. I've also unWoGified the LOD files so it appears almost exactly as SoD.

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Postby Midas » Aug 30 2009, 11:56

Is it easy to use WoG for begginers?
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Postby Deadguy118 » Aug 30 2009, 19:51

Midas wrote:Is it easy to use WoG for begginers?

The initial feature-set of scripts are somewhat daunting, and it will take a while for you to figure out what you like.

I personally don't like WoG because of the mod's "Anything Goes" toybox nature. I think that it detracts from the strategic nature of Heroes and replaces it with half-baked RPG and puzzle elements.

However, I have already had this argument with Salamandre before, so I will keep my mouth shut. Some people like it, I don't.
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Postby GreatEmerald » Aug 30 2009, 22:19

It's easy as long as you do this:
1. Install WoG (the installer is VERY awkward, so beware - no idea why it wasn't updated to a proper one).
2. Open WoG (h3wog.exe) and go to WoG options in the New Game menu.
3. Open each tab and click "deselect all".
4. Look over each tab and enable features which you like (hover the mouse on an option for a tooltip).
5. That's it, you're all set with an enhanced SoD...
...Except for some graphics issues - they replaced primary skill icons with the beta ones (awful looking IMO), the AI RoE shield was replaced by a "In WoG we trust" banner and the battles have crossed sword and arrow in the defend button. Resource bar at the bottom was also altered. I'm currently making an unWoGified set of LODs which revert all those things to what they should be, and will probably put that up once I solve the resource bar problem.

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Postby Salamandre » Aug 31 2009, 2:20

Deadguy118 wrote:I personally don't like WoG because of the mod's "Anything Goes" toybox nature. I think that it detracts from the strategic nature of Heroes and replaces it with half-baked RPG and puzzle elements.


99% of WoG custom maps are exactly as SOD but with more objects and graphics. Only a few maps (mines and Fnord's ones) experimented the RPG and puzzles, but as I said they are an experiment, testing new mechanics. Many hardcore players reacted strongly against this and I can understand it. And many others enjoyed them, so the work was not pointless.

We have enough good SOD maps out, and the role of WoG is to open possible ways toward more options and adventure plots. Otherwise we are going to clone every SoD map, because almost anything was already done. SoD creativity is over, there was no major map done in the last 6 years and we have to counter this in a way or another.

I have faith in WoG. It is not perfect, but it is free, and for a free add-on the team did a goodly job. Chances are great that there will never be another update (the team is broken) so this is all we have...

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Postby Midas » Aug 31 2009, 11:44

what about WoG 3.59? (if im not mistaken)
and the new Grove and Bastion town?

I am waiting for HotA, but it might take a while
and then now I'm starting to get interested in WoG...

but I don't know, I'm not so sure
I'm just afraid that it will be alien to me (not familiar)
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Postby Pol » Aug 31 2009, 18:24

They will be, ...once.

At least I'm under impression that HotA will be before the WoG3.59 but I may be wrong. There isn't much news (Like:"Whoa, we did!") from any of the camp.

HotA is going to be simpler than a true WoG but still based on it. And WoG is going to be more extensible than ever, even now with "A lots of the Spartans" map is wonderful.

So, don't be afraid, there's no reason. :D
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Postby Salamandre » Aug 31 2009, 20:23

Sorry, but if you are going to screw my map title, at least keep being professional: 300 is "swarm", not "lots" :devil:

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Postby JackintheMox » Aug 31 2009, 23:51

WoG is great fun and can be deliciously challenging (i.e. Neutral Bonuses, Neutral Stack Size, and Neutral Stack Experience). I do find myself disabling quite a few of the buildings that normally come along with it but there's plenty of added content that I really dig and keep enabled. I especially love being able to disable the overpowered spells that really ruin the game IMO (Town Portal, Fly, and Dimension Door).

Of course, my huge pet peeve is the MANY times it crashes but it's a small price to pay for re-playability of one of the best games created ever.

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Postby Midas » Sep 1 2009, 9:48

Wow! It's Salamandre :-D

it does sound rather interesting...
now where could i download the latest WoG?

I found 1 link to download WoG, but I had to download 4 pieces of folder, and it was cofusing...
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