How to develop demon's lord at the best?

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hewitt
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How to develop demon's lord at the best?

Unread postby hewitt » 04 Jan 2009, 15:12

i'm at the second campaign third scenario and i'v chosen for agrael skills like logistic(expert so far),attack(expert so far),expert luck,ballista and advanced dark magic(master of curse) in the hope of getting either frenzy or puppet master!
i'v chosen not to take defense,took luck or dark magic instead!
how do those skills i took look like?
right choses after all or i could have chosen something even better?

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Unread postby Asheera » 04 Jan 2009, 15:52

Dark Magic is great for a Demon Lord... at least much better than Destructive, because of the low spellpower.

Luck is a very powerful skill, especially for a might faction like Inferno, so yes it's a good choice. Soldier's Luck is also pretty good since it will increase the chances to strike Fear into your enemies with the Nightmares.

Attack... hmm, it's an almost worthless skill in itself. This skill is good only for its abilities, since the bonus it gives is pretty pathetic. So you should most definitely get three abilities (you said you have Expert Attack).
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Unread postby hewitt » 04 Jan 2009, 16:20

so it would have been better to take defense(maybe expert defense+vitality +magic resistance) instead of attack,isn't it?

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Unread postby Asheera » 04 Jan 2009, 16:30

The defense skill itself is a lot better than attack indeed, but you should also consider that Inferno is a fast attacking faction, so the abilities from attack fit better.

Attack is not such a bad choice. Excruciating Strike ability is very powerful, and so is Tactics which would allow your Devils to get to the enemy ranks in one turn.
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Unread postby danhvo » 04 Jan 2009, 20:09

As you said, Attack is not very good. If you get it for Tactics, the better choice is Leadership and Aura of Swiftness (I'd prefer Aura of Swiftness over Tactics any day). Gate Master is also a very good ability.

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Unread postby Asheera » 04 Jan 2009, 20:10

Unfortunately Leadership has only a 2% chance to pop up for Inferno...
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Unread postby danhvo » 04 Jan 2009, 22:27

There is that. And Attack has 15%, so it will pop a lot if you continue to reject it. Still, 2% is not as small a chance as it sounds, since the number increases once some skills are chosen. I frequently play Haven, and for the last 3 games, my main Knight hero got offered Enlightment (2%) early. I jumped on it, of course, since I usually try to give the main Hero the Mentoring ability to help out the other heroes.

Speaking of which, Enlightment is also another good skill to take in lieu of Attack. But like Leadership, it's a 2% skill for Demon Lords.

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Unread postby Asheera » 04 Jan 2009, 22:33

Unfortunately the Enlightenment abilities pretty much suck for Demon Lord because you don't need Intelligence much because of an already high mana pool (factions like Dungeon though benefit A LOT from Intelligence)

But the bonus from the Enlightenment skill is very good - actually it's the best skill in the game at high levels. However I'm not sure how many points will go to Knowledge for Demon Lord's case, and that would not be very good since you already have more than enough mana...
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Unread postby blizzardboy » 08 Jan 2009, 20:17

The game is too dynamic for there to really be a "best" build. It depends on what you're fighting.

I think nightmares are overrated, so soldier's luck isn't that important for me. But again, there really is no set right answer. Defense is more important than attack for Inferno for the big fights since you need to play defensively, but you need attack for Flaming Arrows since you went ballista, and + Excruciating Strike helps out Mark of the Damned. Your build is fine.
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Unread postby Metathron » 08 Jan 2009, 22:33

What's wrong with the attack skill?
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Unread postby Asheera » 08 Jan 2009, 23:04

5% damage only to melee attacks? Come on, that's pathetic, name one skill that is that weak. :P

Defense gives a 10% reduction which is more than double (since 0.9 has a better impact than 1.1, 0.9 * 1.1 = 0.99 which is less than 1), Luck gives an average +10% more damage to all attacks, not just melee, etc.

As I said, the skill itself is almost useless, but the abilities it gives may prove extremely important.
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Unread postby Banedon » 22 Jan 2009, 04:29

Asheera wrote:5% damage only to melee attacks? Come on, that's pathetic, name one skill that is that weak. :P

Defense gives a 10% reduction which is more than double (since 0.9 has a better impact than 1.1, 0.9 * 1.1 = 0.99 which is less than 1), Luck gives an average +10% more damage to all attacks, not just melee, etc.

As I said, the skill itself is almost useless, but the abilities it gives may prove extremely important.
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Unread postby Angelspit » 22 Jan 2009, 11:56

Asheera wrote:(since 0.9 has a better impact than 1.1, 0.9 * 1.1 = 0.99 which is less than 1),
Whoaa... slow down, miss, it's still early.... :tired:
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Unread postby Asheera » 22 Jan 2009, 12:55

Banedon wrote:He who strikes the first blow hardest might never have to strike again ...
Hmm not sure what you mean, but that applies when both sides have attack -> the one who strikes first will have a huge advantage. That's not the case when one side has defense and one attack. Simply put, side A has defense and side B has attack -> side A's defense neutralizes side B's attack, and offers additional protection as well (as I explained, Defense is greater than Attack)

So I don't agree. If you get Defense, you have a lot better chances to resist the attacks. In fact, you'll neutralize the enemy's skill completely (Attack) while still getting some protective effects. Your sentence would be correct if both sides would get attack, but then again, that's the whole point: to prove that getting attack is worse than defense (if not for the abilities, of course)

Ok there's also the case when you're fighting a destructive magic hero in which case Defense won't do much good, and you'd probably want attack to kill the enemy creatures as fast as possible.


@AS: lol that post was made a long time ago. :D
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Unread postby wimfrits » 22 Jan 2009, 18:43

Inferno typically is a very high attack, high initiative, low Hp faction. It's not suited for long battles; attacking swift and hard is it's best chance for winning. So imo attack works a lot better than defense for Inferno.
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Unread postby Asheera » 22 Jan 2009, 19:28

Indeed but a 5% increase to melee damage is not that impressive IMO, and you'd be surprised to see how much your units get attacked as well (the Devils can't even reach the enemy in first turn without some speed boosts)

Definitely I wouldn't take attack just for the skill itself (perhaps for the abilities), there are a lot better choices out there (not saying defense, but luck, leadership, dark magic, etc)
No matter how powerful one becomes, there is always someone stronger. That's why I'm in a constant pursuit of power, so I can be prepared when an enemy tries to take advantage of me.


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