Orc Town Suggestion

[tb5841]

There was a thread for this before, but I couldn't see it - anyway, I finally thought up an orc town idea that I like, please tell me what you think. It goes something like this:

Orcs are very numerous, and very aggressive, and so they are not limited by creature growth like other races. To make up for this in terms of balance, most creatures cost resources other than gold.

Creature lineup:

L1 - Goblin --> Hobgoblin. Cheap walkers with low stats, cost only gold (so you could easily amass huge numbers of them).

L2 - Orc --> Orc Archer. Orcs are high-initiative troops with magic resistance, and gain a ranged attack when upgraded. As well as costing gold, orcs also cost 1 wood, and orc archers cost gold and 2 wood.

L3 - Ogre --> Ogre Magi. Ogres are slow defensive units with high health, and they regenerate health each turn. When upgraded they gain a few light/dark magic spells. They have the enraged ability. Ogres cost gold and 1 ore, ogre magi gold and 2 ore.

L4 - Centaur --> Centaur Veteran. Centaurs are decent ranged units with a barbed shot that reduces enemy defence for a round after being hit. When upgraded, they also gain a scatter-shot ability (like archers). Cost 1 sulfur as well as gold, 2 sulfur when upgraded.

L5 - Wolf Rider --> Wolf Raider. Fast, high-initiative cavalry whose stats increase for every enemy stack that dies on the battlefield. When upgraded, they attack twice. Large creature. Cost 1 mercury in addition to gold, 2 when upgraded.

L6 - Roc --> Thunderbird. Fast, high-initiative flyer. When upgraded they become immune to lightning, and when they attack there is a chance enemies will be struck by a lightning bolt. Large creature. Cost 2 gems + gold, 3 gems + gold when upgraded.

L7 - Behemoth --> Ancient Behemoth. Slow, powerful walker, ignores all enemy defence on attack. Once upgraded, also reduces enemy initiative upon attack. Large creature. Costs 3 crystal + gold, 4 crystal + gold when upgraded.

Racial skill: Scavenger - heroes gain gold/resources from victorious battles, the amount depends on the size of the vanquished army.

Resource silo produces a random resource each game, so the army you build will vary lots depending on your resource silo and on which mines you can take first. Mage guild has dark and light magic, but will obviously be harder to build than with other teams due to creature resource costs. Hero specialises in attack, with a reasonable amount of defence, but very low spellpower/knowledge.

What do you think?

[Odolwa]

What do you think?

As I use to say, the unit-names need to be improved.

[ThunderTitan]

I think that the Ogres and the Centaurs should trade places. They also seem to cost way too much in resources, but i guess that could be balanced with the racial and the amount the Resource silo produces.

[Mirez]

centaur?
read the timeline
centaurs where made after the orcs fled

[Elvin]

Awfully familiar.I could do with something more refreshing.Then again if the units themselves were different in some way or had interesting abilities...

[tb5841]

centaur?
read the timeline
centaurs where made after the orcs fled

It was the timeline that gave me the idea. Centaurs definitely exist in the HOMM5 world, and so they should be in the game. They obviously do not serve the wizards now, and they have a lot in common with the orcs, so it seemed logical. But it wouldn't matter if they weren't there.

I think that the Ogres and the Centaurs should trade places.

I thought about this, but I didn't want too many low-level shooters. But wouldn't make a huge difference if they were switched.

Awfully familiar.I could do with something more refreshing.Then again if the units themselves were different in some way or had interesting abilities...

Fair point. Nothing is hugely original about the units. And yes, some of the names aren't great.

But the main point of the town is the racial ability/units costing resources/no growth limit, which I think would make the town seem original and give it a very different feel to the others. Change all the units if you like.

[ramparter]

Resources over gold ruins the whole balance.

[Mirez]

yeah they should only need gold wood and ore no other stuff

and who says they aren't with the wizards anymore? they're just not fighting they serve as amusement etc.

[DaemianLucifer]

Resources over gold ruins the whole balance.

Why?It is said that they arent limited by growth.

But Id change the cost a bit:
Lvl2 - 1 wood;1 wood 1 ore when upgraded
Lvl3 - 1 wood 1 ore;2 wood 1 ore when upgraded
Lvl4 - 1 sulfur;1 ore 1 sulfur when upgraded
Lvl5 - 1 mercury;1 wood 1 mercury when upgraded
Lvl6 - 1 gem;1 wood 1 ore 2 gem when upgraded
Lvl7 - 1 wood 1 ore 2 crystal;2 wood 2 ore 4 crystal when upgraded

[ThunderTitan]

But Id change the cost a bit:
Lvl2 - 1 wood;1 wood 1 ore when upgraded
Lvl3 - 1 wood 1 ore;2 wood 1 ore when upgraded
Lvl4 - 1 sulfur;1 ore 1 sulfur when upgraded
Lvl5 - 1 mercury;1 wood 1 mercury when upgraded
Lvl6 - 1 gem;1 wood 1 ore 2 gem when upgraded
Lvl7 - 1 wood 1 ore 2 crystal;2 wood 2 ore 4 crystal when upgraded

The problem is that they'd need to get one hell of alot more resources then the other factions.
Maybe if the RS would give extra resources as the town increases in lvl.

[vicheron]

I think that Goblns and Orcs on Ashan hate each other.

[winterfate]

tb5841 wrote : There was a thread for this before, but I couldn't see it - anyway, I finally thought up an orc town idea that I like, please tell me what you think. It goes something like this:

Orcs are very numerous, and very aggressive, and so they are not limited by creature growth like other races. To make up for this in terms of balance, most creatures cost resources other than gold.

Creature lineup:

L1 - Goblin --> Hobgoblin. Cheap walkers with low stats, cost only gold (so you could easily amass huge numbers of them).

L2 - Orc --> Orc Archer. Orcs are high-initiative troops with magic resistance, and gain a ranged attack when upgraded. As well as costing gold, orcs also cost 1 wood, and orc archers cost gold and 2 wood.

L3 - Ogre --> Ogre Magi. Ogres are slow defensive units with high health, and they regenerate health each turn. When upgraded they gain a few light/dark magic spells. They have the enraged ability. Ogres cost gold and 1 ore, ogre magi gold and 2 ore.

L4 - Centaur --> Centaur Veteran. Centaurs are decent ranged units with a barbed shot that reduces enemy defence for a round after being hit. When upgraded, they also gain a scatter-shot ability (like archers). Cost 1 sulfur as well as gold, 2 sulfur when upgraded.

L5 - Wolf Rider --> Wolf Raider. Fast, high-initiative cavalry whose stats increase for every enemy stack that dies on the battlefield. When upgraded, they attack twice. Large creature. Cost 1 mercury in addition to gold, 2 when upgraded.

L6 - Roc --> Thunderbird. Fast, high-initiative flyer. When upgraded they become immune to lightning, and when they attack there is a chance enemies will be struck by a lightning bolt. Large creature. Cost 2 gems + gold, 3 gems + gold when upgraded.

L7 - Behemoth --> Ancient Behemoth. Slow, powerful walker, ignores all enemy defence on attack. Once upgraded, also reduces enemy initiative upon attack. Large creature. Costs 3 crystal + gold, 4 crystal + gold when upgraded.

Racial skill: Scavenger - heroes gain gold/resources from victorious battles, the amount depends on the size of the vanquished army.

Resource silo produces a random resource each game, so the army you build will vary lots depending on your resource silo and on which mines you can take first. Mage guild has dark and light magic, but will obviously be harder to build than with other teams due to creature resource costs. Hero specialises in attack, with a reasonable amount of defence, but very low spellpower/knowledge.

What do you think?

The whole "resource cost, no limitation of creature growth concept" is original. I like it. However, it be kind of cool to have switch out some of the units for new ones (because every single unit in your faction has existed previously in heroes), and like Elvin says:

Then again if the units themselves were different in some way or had interesting abilities...

I second that thought completely .[/quote]

[ThunderTitan]

I think that Goblns and Orcs on Ashan hate each other.

So?! That doesn't mean they can't be in the same town, especialy as the orcs are larger.

[theGryphon]

I think the idea is very original (the units are not at all though), but it would be impossible to balance it as proposed here.

I'd rather like to see a limited creature growth maybe higher than the other factions. What would be interesting is zero dwelling building costs with no prerequisites. Recruiting the creatures would cost gold and/or resources depending on the tier. You would be able to build a single dwelling per day still. Such a system would be much more easy to balance.

[ramparter]

Problem with the resources is that depending on the map you could either be able to afford too few of the high leved creatures or too much. For example an extra crystal mine will provide you 2 more bohemoths every week. That's how I see it.

For the orcs race I would prefer something like "Breeding" to be their racial. Creatures in your army grow in number every week like the neutral stacks on adventure map. Again this is just my opinion.

[DaemianLucifer]

I think that Goblns and Orcs on Ashan hate each other.

How come there are both goblins and orcs in a camp in DMoMM?

[Odolwa]

Must say you got a very good variety of creatures =)
Especially compared to the worthless Fortress-faction, with 6 units of the same race

[Mirez]

well warlords an thanes aren't dwarfes... they look more like giants

[Elvin]

Must say you got a very good variety of creatures =)
Especially compared to the worthless Fortress-faction, with 6 units of the same race

Variety?It's the same thing all over again unit-wise.
Have you actually played HoF or are you commenting on screenshots?Because they have little to nothing in common with each other(except the beards ) and have a reason to have this lineup.Worthless?Riight!

[ThunderTitan]

well warlords an thanes aren't dwarfes... they look more like giants

FC said they're Giant Dwarfs.

Variety?It's the same thing all over again unit-wise.
Because they have little to nothing in common with each other(except the beards smile_teeth ) and have a reason to have this lineup.Worthless?Riight!

You now that by that logic all the creatures from all the towns could be the same race/model as long as they have different abilities.

I for one would like to have both different creatures and abilities. Having 6 stubby bearded humanoids is boring.