Guys, give UBI a breath...

[mr.hackcrag]

Almost all of these have already been answered many times before. And I thought there was already a list compiled that addresses a lot of these issues. At least I'm pretty sure I saw a sticky of it once.

The fact that it's not designed like a real poll also makes typing it all again unnecessary because we already know what most peoples response is going to be to all these questions. Yes, cutscenes look like crap, yes, many spells like phantom and animate are too powerful, yes, more creatures are always great (so long as they are unique; please no more dragons.) yes, caravans are fantastic. All this by now should be common knowledge.

[Omega_Destroyer]

Agreed. There isn't much more to say on the topic.

[Kalah]

So should we close the topic?

[Omega_Destroyer]

I say go for it unless there are any good objections.

[jeff]

Umm, so is your point that the game was rushed out? If so, yes it was but if i put myself in the shoes of Nival staff then i'd probably do the same. You see it's these horrible things called shareholders.

The same reason that forced 3DO to release H-IV before it was done, except they were on the verge of bankruptcy, UBI and Nival are not. 3DO took a lot of criticism for their action UBI/Nival should expect no less.

So should we close the topic?

I know I've said this at least one in this thread, so it may be time to stick a fork in it.

[GrowlingDog]

Well ive now added my poll and i welcome any other questions in the poll (forgot to ask about artifacts). If we already know all the answers to the poll then i come right back to my initial point, Why complain so much about "No map editor" and so on if we and Nival already know about it. In th eend i feel after posting the poll i hav that at least iv tried to make a difference to the game, now i must rest (said Galactus after consuming yet another planet)

[Derek]

So should we close the topic?

I'd say so. I'm all for criticizing a game when it makes mistakes and such ,but most of the complaints here lack any sort of point or direction(or logic for that matter). I think the critics should get together on CH and form one list to post as a topic/thread listing all the (supposed?)myriad problems with the game.

Disclaimer for the curious: I do not own H5, so do not think that I am defending it because I'm a fanboy or anything. *Sigh*...I truly hate that I must say such things but apparently that's the way things(these discussions) are.

[Caradoc]

By popular request, according the ASP.NET, the top ten causes of bugs are:

10. Poor training. (coding, business analysis, tools, infrastructure etc…)
9. Laziness – the desire to use the easiest to implement solution.
8. Compromises made in req/design to meet delivery schedules.
7. Coding methodology failures such as bad or missing error handling.
6. Vague or incomplete requirements.
5. Misunderstanding of the requirements.
4. Poor design.
3. Misapplication of technology. (Components, products, techniques)
2. Lack of testing.

And the number 1 reason for software bugs is…

1. Change: to requirements, infrastructure, tools etc., because it introduces the likelihood of all of the above to happen.

[shone976]

As I have said before in some other post, the thing is, that Ubi and Nival were in crisis with deadlines. They had to finish the game in particular time and mistakes were inevitable. The other thing is whan you have a deadline while making a great game like this, is that you must sacrifise at a lot of things like graphics, AI, maps, etc.

For the next sequel of Heroes, I just hope that they will organise themselves better and make the final product before releasing it.

I fully agree with postmaker, and say again give 'em a break...

In other way, make it yourself if you know better.


Luckz...

[DaemianLucifer]

As I have said before in some other post, the thing is, that Ubi and Nival were in crisis with deadlines. They had to finish the game in particular time and mistakes were inevitable. The other thing is whan you have a deadline while making a great game like this, is that you must sacrifise at a lot of things like graphics, AI, maps, etc.

Sonce ubi made those deadines,they couldve changed them if they saw that the game needed more time.But no,it is more important to have a good profit in the end of the quartal then to finish the game and get even more money in the long run.

[mr.hackcrag]

*sigh* And we were so close to finally closing this thread... Well, here we go again.

If you look at the list, you'll find that more than half of the excuses were related to poor design or staff. This reflects badly on the company and shows they weren't ready to handle the task and needed more time to get their act together. But they ignored our delay plea and decided to go ahead and release it knowing full well that the game was not ready. Heck, we even helped them with a some of the problems like bugs during the beta test, and even now with the bug list. You think they would have listened to us a little more. But to paraphrase DL, capitalism continues to trump quality. (or common sense for that matter.)

And then after the release, their incompetance was even more apparent. So why give them a break when they really don't deserve one?

[GrowlingDog]

It would seem that pressure from the shareholders to produce a good financial 1/4 pushed Ubi to release the game early. Shareholders can have people fired if they are not making a good dividend, gamers can complain about the game but it would seem, especially with the long time fans, that they will buy and play the game regardless. It's a perfectly logical decision and in the same position, we would nearly all do the same. It's not Capitilism thats to blame, its just human nature and its human nature that drives us to want to make AND play these games in the 1st place. Impatience is also part of human nature and comes easily but we have to TRY and be patient .
Now hurry up and respond.

[Ethric]

I for one hold that unless we're talking about force majeure (and that is as far as I know not the case), whatever excuses made does not release ubi\nival from their responsibility to their customers for any lack of quality in their product.

[GrowlingDog]

Ethric wrote:
I for one hold that unless we're talking about force majeure (and that is as far as I know not the case), whatever excuses made does not release ubi\nival from their responsibility to their customers for any lack of quality in their product.

Totally agree, Nuff said (thankyou Stan Lee)

[mr.hackcrag]

Ethric wrote:
I for one hold that unless we're talking about force majeure (and that is as far as I know not the case), whatever excuses made does not release ubi\nival from their responsibility to their customers for any lack of quality in their product.

Totally agree, Nuff said (thankyou Stan Lee)

This statement totally contradicts your last post.

And Caradoc, why did you say that the list of reasons that h5 has so many bugs would surprise us? All of the things in the top 10 are things that I had already assumed the second I played the game. No force majeure's here.

[LordErtz]

Ethric wrote:
I for one hold that unless we're talking about force majeure (and that is as far as I know not the case), whatever excuses made does not release ubi\nival from their responsibility to their customers for any lack of quality in their product.

Totally agree, Nuff said (thankyou Stan Lee)

This statement totally contradicts your last post.

And Caradoc, why did you say that the list of reasons that h5 has so many bugs would surprise us? All of the things in the top 10 are things that I had already assumed the second I played the game. No force majeure's here.

Then you, my friend, are the only one who bought a game expecting it to be bugged and incomplete before you bought it.

[GrowlingDog]

And just how does it "Totally contradict" my last statement. I mentioned nothing about responsibilty to fans. I stated possible reasons why they did release the game, never said they shouldnt fix it or that they are not responsible for the games faults. Are you reading my posts?

[mr.hackcrag]

LordErtz, I think you misread my post, or I didn't right it clearly enough. I meant that once I started playing the game and found it's obvious faults, from that point, I assumed that the developers released it too soon. And thankfully, I didn't waste my money on H5. My friend bought it and I played it at his house. If I did buy it, then I would have ended up as angry as he for spending his hard earned money on a miserable failure.

And GD, first you wrote that so long as shareholders are happy, everything else is of much lesser importance. Then you said you agree with Ethric's point that the company has a responsibilty to customers to create a quality product. The interest of shareholders and the interest of customers are not in alignment.

In fact, they have an even bigger responsibility to us because from the beginning, they were in contact with us to find out what we thought H5 should be like. We went through a lot of strain to get our point across, (and we are still doing it) but in the end, they completely betrayed us.

On top of that, I don't understand why you're argueing against something that would have worked to your benefit, in this case, a better homm game.

[GrowlingDog]

Mr Hackcrag, i'm not arguing against a better H5, i was just trying to show things from a Nival management point of view (the actual programmers probably told them it wasnt ready), i never said i agreed with it or liked their decision, basically i was just trying to say, from a Nival management point of view, it would be easier and safer (possibly for their own employment) to release the game when they did and in an incomplete manner. It appeases the higher ups that are looking at the bottom line (profit). The fans, while upset have shown (like in H4) that they will buy the game incomplete and wait for the patches. It wasn't meant to mean i agreed with them but just that i can understand why they did it.

[mr.hackcrag]

Hence, capitalism trumps quality once again.