CH Forum vs HV

The new Heroes games produced by Ubisoft. Please specify which game you are referring to in your post.
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Veldrynus
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Unread postby Veldrynus » 14 May 2006, 18:48

theGryphon wrote: How old are you Veldrynus? Just curious...
Old enough.
Veldryn 15:15 And Vel found a dirty old jawbone of a walrus and put forth his hand, and took it, and in his unholy rage, he slew thirty four thousand men and children therewith.

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Unread postby dragonn » 14 May 2006, 19:19

Veldrynus wrote: I wished a game wich would correct the flaws of H4, but not by making a huge step backwards.
I expected a H3 clone. Nothing optimistic about it.
Well I also thought the next heroes game will combine the best of the series in one, but unfortunetly it didn't...

The "no H4" strategy is bad, very limited...
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Unread postby Kalah » 14 May 2006, 19:44

It is true that the negative outweighs the positive in game-related discussion. It has been that way for some time. Many threads get started on negative issues; I recall my starting up a thread asking "what do you LIKE" got attention as it was the first one to do so for a long time...
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Unread postby Bandobras Took » 14 May 2006, 21:36

Ethric wrote:I've been complaining on and off ever since Ubi\Nival's plans for H5 took shape, so not going to stop now that it's nearing release.
The main difference being, Ethric, that your complaints are usually well-thought out and lack a great deal of the emotional diatribe that's begun to run rampant.
Far too many people speak their minds without first verifying the quality of their source material.

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Unread postby Bloodstar » 14 May 2006, 22:00

Bandobras Took wrote:
Ethric wrote:I've been complaining on and off ever since Ubi\Nival's plans for H5 took shape, so not going to stop now that it's nearing release.
The main difference being, Ethric, that your complaints are usually well-thought out and lack a great deal of the emotional diatribe that's begun to run rampant.

Hmmm. being ass kisser is not an envious characteristic of humanoids...

Ask Fabrice how French are all political, they have opinion about everything and make debates etc...

I don't find that wrong! You have to learn term of free speech and what is this all about but not just learn it....

If man cannot fight for his right to say something then that is really a pitiful on Internet or in real life... that is a worm.


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Unread postby jeff » 14 May 2006, 23:22

First it is human nature to complain, especially when something is not as you would like it. Many of use were frequent contributors to the various threads on the old forum, which solicited our opinions on what we would like to see. Remember those, Ethric as I recall even summarized a few. What happened to those threads and the ideas? UBI said they were swamped and stopped looking at them, and that is a shame there were a lot of good ideas in those threads that UBI has chosen to ignore. Hey it’s their property and they have a right to take the series anywhere they want, but they may end up taking fewer people with them than they might have. I have stated in several threads, Heroes is the first word in the title of the game, so why replace all of the heroes. A new world is not new in the might and magic universe, this has happened before, but many of the heroes have been with us for several editions. It may be their right, but it at the very least was inconsiderate of UBI. Having said that, since H-V is going to be a turn-based strategy game with a magic system, and it appears to have many strange and perhaps wonderful creatures; I will give it a look. The map editor must have a campaign feature otherwise, it will be a no buy, but that’s me. Since they turned their back on most/all of the old heroes and placed it in a new world/universe, then it must stand on its own, no sympathy or free pass I might have been inclined to give it for being part of a series I have played since the beginning. I have not played the Demo and did not play any of the beta releases. Multiplayer games I am sure are fun, but they are not for me. I will hold my opinion until the final release comes and the editor capabilities are known, then as I said I will decide based on this as a first game in a new series, they can ask for nothing more.
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Re: CH Forum vs HV

Unread postby Zamolxis » 15 May 2006, 00:24

theGryphon wrote:All in all, it's really sad that the CH forum is so negative about HV. Aren't you all guys a bit inconsistent? I mean what if there were no HV?
I haven't read all the posts, maybe sb already gave this answer. Anyway, for me the issue is like this.

Take sth you love very much (let's say your wife, your mother etc). Let's say one day that person suffers a tragic accident and dies. But in that moment of pain, suddently a magician appears, and promises to resurrect your most loved, for a certain fee. You agree blindly (like we supported Ubi blindly in the beginning). But when the "resurrection" ritual is over, you realize you have in front of you just a zombie, made of the same flesh & bones, but still not the person you actually wanted back, without that soul... sth that resambles the what you loved, but doesn't feel at all like that.

Now who's to blame? Is it us to be stoned for not accepting the "failed resurrection"? Are we those who are wrong, or too picky, or too whiny, for not loving the new "product", whatever that product it is?

I'm also not saying the magician (aka the developer) is totally wrong and to be stoned. Maybe his intentions were good, only his skills were not good enough to cast the right spell - aka the ability of finding a succesful recepy to satisfy almost all fans.

Let's say none should be stoned. But at least those who are disappointed with what they made out of it, should be given the right mourn about it, without others judging it. We could choose to mourn in silence, and not bother others about it, but this will slowly only make us step out of the community eventually (you can't force sb to like sth). But this doesn't solve the problem. Only diminuishes the community and doesn't motivate that magician to study/sweat some more till he gets the spell right.

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Re: CH Forum vs HV

Unread postby Zamolxis » 15 May 2006, 00:44

theGryphon wrote:You want HV be the last title? Then, go for it. I would expect more constructive comments/criticisms from such experienced group of players. I urge you to think about it.
Ubisoft is a large company and they won't go down if this game turns out to be a failure.
If I want HV to be the last title? Of course not. But the reality is as such that for me H3 feels like the last title. H4 represented lots of steps back combined with lots of experiments (some succeded, some failed). H5 is a bit above that only thanks to Fabrice's efforts, but if you ask me which way do I want to remember Heroes as a game, if it would really be ment to die, I still think of H3. I prefer that memory than too many failed attempts of resurrection.

Now, before you get me wrong, I'd like to tell you I actually played a pretty active role in saveheroes.org - in spite of the fact that I was disappointed in the game. Why? Because in fact I'm not (and nobody here is, in spite of what you imply) sb who would really like the game to fail so that Ubi burries the brand, just because they didn't do a good job. I did play my part and supported the game in that critical moment (including the open beta helpers moment), to avoid that burrial, because actually I *do* want to give the magician a couple of more chances (although I lost a lot of my initial optimism).

But seeing the activity on the forums, the demo and reaction to the demo, so many people willing to buy the game, I know that the game's future is assured at Ubi. That point achieved, I think it's time I step back in the other "camp", and state my feelings openly (like so many others), to let Ubi know why they sold only half of what they could have.

So my message to the developer is NOT "whatever you do, we'll hate you" but "do it right, and you'll sell double". Whether the developer reads the correct or wrong message in our complains, that's only his problem.

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Re: CH Forum vs HV

Unread postby Bloodstar » 15 May 2006, 10:44

So my message to the developer is NOT "whatever you do, we'll hate you" but "do it right, and you'll sell double". Whether the developer reads the correct or wrong message in our complains, that's only his problem.
Amen to that!

I am big Heroes fan. I also have a webshop for selling games. I also plan to organize Heroes V tournament. Nobody will get killed from a little criticizing and that is not bad, quite contrary it is in fact good so developers will hear us players...

I sent email to Nival and Ubi Soft because I wanted to organize Heroes V tournament sometime after release in one Cyber Caffe in Zagreb, Croatia. I sent email to Nival and Ubi Soft.

THEY DIDN'T EVEN REPLIED TO ME :(((

Now tell me is that good thing or bad thing that I wanted to make Heroes 5 tournament. Imagine Ubi Soft possibilities of good PR if that is organized in many other countries... They will get even mentioning in press etc...
I asked if they wanted to send something for first three places etc... and some posters etc... Fabrice if you read this think about it.
I would also give some games to 1st, 2nd, and 3rd place... Heroes V could be good tournament game with new multiplayer modes etc...
Anyway you have mostly FPS and RTS that kids are playing, this is TBS and this would be great and Ubi Soft and Nival choosed to ignore my idea.
That's their choice I am still at their disposal to talk about this and I am sure that there are a lot more fans in other countries that could do the same. This would generate more sales I am sure.

I also asked if they would give us some special tournament small maps or something like that unpublished... hehe but judging by number of maps that they will release in game this would be fat chance that they will support tournament play in that sort...

And now tell me is this my idea productive and constructive or not?


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Nebs
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Unread postby Nebs » 15 May 2006, 14:42

Bloodstar, webshop is in Zagreb also? And will you have H5?

Called Algoritam, but they are not sure if they will sell it...now have to find other place as leaked version is no good for me. Lacks multiplayer.

And that tourny sounds great, I'd be there for sure.

Btw, also Mario here. ;)

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igoraki
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Unread postby igoraki » 15 May 2006, 14:45

hi Zamolxis

nice to see you more active here at ch

agree with you,we dont want the ubi to fail with the game,we just want better game

my guess is they concetrate too much on the visual side of the game,much more then on the gameplay and new ideas that can improve game more that any eyecandy can

still i hope they sell enough copies to continue developing

strange thing is that you prefer h3,i prefer h4 but we ended with same feelings toward h5

haha,guess ubi never expected that
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Unread postby Bloodstar » 15 May 2006, 15:22

Nebs wrote:Bloodstar, webshop is in Zagreb also? And will you have H5?

Called Algoritam, but they are not sure if they will sell it...now have to find other place as leaked version is no good for me. Lacks multiplayer.

And that tourny sounds great, I'd be there for sure.

Btw, also Mario here. ;)

Hello Mario, imenjace :D

Well, yes, my webshop is on www.technomatic.hr
We are still not selling games at that rate so to buy big quantity except every 3-4 month... yes that sucks but due to pirates and low buying power and other factors we cannot for now do better. But, I hope that situation will get better.
We got new games around 15 april... I would love to stock enormous quantity of Heroes V and sell it just because I am big fan and have many friends that are fans of heroses but I cannot order now games because transportation costs are high etc, and games are expensive urgh. very...

So I will have later Heroes 5 unfortunately... sorry. Don't know when.

Regarding tournament - I will do it and I am quite ready to do it no matter what. With Ubi Soft blessing or without!
;)

I already have talked with one boss from one Cyber caffe or Igraona on Croatian :D he said to me that one Sunday is ok... I am glad that you are also interested. I will post here and on Usenet etc... information about tournament and when it will be... I think that it is good idea.
I hope that I will make this tournament, I will try. It can be made also later when players get used to the game. Leave me your email so that I can send you info. vonconrad@gmail.com



BTW, Ubi Soft marketing guys obviously doesn't undertsand PR, business etc... They have poured millions of $ into marketing on their King Kong and made millions of copies of that game and GUESS WHAT - now my distributor sells this game ON DISCOUNT price. So Ubisoft you have idiots in your marketing dept. It would be much better that you put more money to advertise Heroes V.
Plus to back up project like this... That is called good PR... You will get promotion for some small prizes etc...And people would buy a lot more Ubi Soft games...

Better than putting millions into King Kong marketing, believe me. Another constructive proposal...


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Re: CH Forum vs HV

Unread postby Znork » 21 May 2006, 16:24

Zamolxis wrote:
theGryphon wrote:You want HV be the last title? Then, go for it. I would expect more constructive comments/criticisms from such experienced group of players. I urge you to think about it.
Ubisoft is a large company and they won't go down if this game turns out to be a failure.
If I want HV to be the last title? Of course not. But the reality is as such that for me H3 feels like the last title. H4 represented lots of steps back combined with lots of experiments (some succeded, some failed). H5 is a bit above that only thanks to Fabrice's efforts, but if you ask me which way do I want to remember Heroes as a game, if it would really be ment to die, I still think of H3. I prefer that memory than too many failed attempts of resurrection.

Now, before you get me wrong, I'd like to tell you I actually played a pretty active role in saveheroes.org - in spite of the fact that I was disappointed in the game. Why? Because in fact I'm not (and nobody here is, in spite of what you imply) sb who would really like the game to fail so that Ubi burries the brand, just because they didn't do a good job. I did play my part and supported the game in that critical moment (including the open beta helpers moment), to avoid that burrial, because actually I *do* want to give the magician a couple of more chances (although I lost a lot of my initial optimism).

But seeing the activity on the forums, the demo and reaction to the demo, so many people willing to buy the game, I know that the game's future is assured at Ubi. That point achieved, I think it's time I step back in the other "camp", and state my feelings openly (like so many others), to let Ubi know why they sold only half of what they could have.

So my message to the developer is NOT "whatever you do, we'll hate you" but "do it right, and you'll sell double". Whether the developer reads the correct or wrong message in our complains, that's only his problem.
sad to her you feel that way zam, well i love the game and i am having fun. You might have been expecting to muche.
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Unread postby chaosgorgon » 21 May 2006, 18:22

guess that there is a BIG difference between the ppl who liked H4 -that dont mean are H4 fans- and ppl that defend H5, ans ppl who hated H4 and ppl who dont see reason to buy H5

for the guys that liked H4 the game but knew already that the game had some very weak points, but also considering other turn based games that they had played, so these weak points were upgradable

the H4 haters were just blinded dumbasses that thought that some changes could destroy their lives, and after to see some weak points they start a campaing to destroy the whole game

the guys that dont like H5 express their reasons, and is basically, "why is should buy this game if is basically the same stuff?", isnt "i hate this" crapy arguments, just why i should bother??

the guys that defend H5 have the same crappy agrument "new ideas is bad idea", lol, and start with all their psico-traumes, and thinks that H3 was done by God itself, lol

isnt if you have or not good ideas is about how you implement them

anyway i dont think that the game is a complete failure, just that will be better ones, i wouldnt bother to purchase the game, but i wont destroy it, i guess gona wait the expansion, if the darfs are the new town ill be definitively out of the series -too much T crap-, im mostly interested in modding the game -is see that H5 have a huge potential to make it actually an interesting game-, dont know if graphics can be supported by G-max???

really there are some guys that are worried if the treant or the angel looks nice or dumb.........i think that is the last stuff to be worried

btw now that UBI is haapy with H5, why not release the code of H4???

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Unread postby Znork » 21 May 2006, 18:49

Wow you guys breake whine record. Have any of you tried it?
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Unread postby chaosgorgon » 21 May 2006, 19:01

ok, znork, who is whining here???, " just why bother to buy it" isnt whining, i mean i dont start a thread of how looks treants or titans, actually i was far more optimist than you in the beta testing phase, lol
Last edited by chaosgorgon on 21 May 2006, 19:04, edited 1 time in total.

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Unread postby DaemianLucifer » 21 May 2006, 19:03

Znork wrote:Wow you guys breake whine record. Have any of you tried it?
I did.And I regret it.

But I must admit one thing:This is the first heroes game that I was able to quit instantly,without the "just one more turn" phenomena.It can be viewed as a good thing as well.

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Unread postby Znork » 21 May 2006, 19:09

DaemianLucifer wrote:
Znork wrote:Wow you guys breake whine record. Have any of you tried it?
I did.And I regret it.

But I must admit one thing:This is the first heroes game that I was able to quit instantly,without the "just one more turn" phenomena.It can be viewed as a good thing as well.
So how many minuts of play have you done?
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Unread postby Znork » 21 May 2006, 19:14

chaosgorgon wrote:ok, znork, who is whining here???, " just why bother to buy it" isnt whining, i mean i dont start a thread of how looks treants or titans, actually i was far more optimist than you in the beta testing phase, lol
If you say the game is bad without trying it you whine, if you tell me its becuse of this i dont like well ok. But i realy dont understand any of you, i have been playing the whole weekend and i hade greate fun. The game is not perfect, but this is the first game in many years hve enjoyd as muche as i do thid game. I suspect many of you are scared of the new game, not that i dont understand that. Well i dont think i cans say other then this, the game is getting 8 and 9 out of then im magaizns and on the net. So maybe the game is not for all hardcore heros fans, but that dosent make it a bad game. Well ill go back to play now im in the middel of the necromancer campaing. And well the look awasom and there are som real fun tactics i need to try out. Enjoy the rest of the weekend you all!
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Unread postby DaemianLucifer » 21 May 2006, 19:19

Znork wrote:So how many minuts of play have you done?
Almost the whole heaven campaign(Became too bored to finish it),and I started three MP maps as a wizard,dungeon and necropolis.Didnt manage to last more then a month in any of them.I tried and tried,but I simply couldnt.


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