How hard is it to look at Heroes 3 specifics for a 3D heroes

The new Heroes games produced by Ubisoft. Please specify which game you are referring to in your post.

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ChimTheGrim
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How hard is it to look at Heroes 3 specifics for a 3D heroes

Postby ChimTheGrim » Sep 3 2010, 14:45

--[please read whole post if you wish to reply]--

As we all know, Heroes VI was just announced, and yet it does look pretty cool.

Yet I have some basic level stuff that I really am amazed these developers cant figure out.

FIRST OFF ---

1. Stop trying to make a over-the-top strategy game that looks and breaths unlike its 2D counter-parts.

What do I mean?
In heroes 1, 2, & 3 the view was panned out from far away, and all of the towns, resources, creatures, and items were easily viewable from far away.

Why is this important?
In heroes 5 and 6 if you try to play the game from a far away panned out view, you will not be able to see the resources or any of the other things mentioned well enough to play the game. This is absolutely retarded. It takes away from the heroes gameplay that was so enjoyable.

SECOND OFF ---

2. Stop trying so hard to make a damn heroes game. Its easy.

Step 1: ALL YOU GOTTA DO IS TAKE HEROES 3 (can easily view the map).
Step 2: AND GET A FREGGIN BLENDER.
Step 3: AND GET HEROES V heroes battle system (heroes have turns).
STEP 4: and HIT THE DAMN BLENDING BUTTON.

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Postby Mirez » Sep 3 2010, 15:49

Well that's your opinion. You are one of those heroes 3 players that only want a nicer looking version of the game and nothing else.

Heroes VI will have a view in which you can see everything without changing the camera around, so you won't have to worry about that.
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Postby Darkström » Sep 3 2010, 15:58

Aren't there already enough threads to post one's opinion? ;|

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Postby Nelgirith » Sep 3 2010, 16:49

I'm sure if Ubi made an exact copy of Heroes 3 just in nice 3D, you'd be the first to cry about their lack of inspiration ;|

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Re: How hard is it to look at Heroes 3 specifics for a 3D he

Postby MattII » Sep 3 2010, 18:51

ChimTheGrim wrote:1. Stop trying to make a over-the-top strategy game that looks and breaths unlike its 2D counter-parts.

Have to disagree with you here, I like a game (or a story) that's properly thought out rather than just thrown together for the hell of it and kept in place by the plot.

2. Stop trying so hard to make a damn heroes game. Its easy.

Step 1: ALL YOU GOTTA DO IS TAKE HEROES 3 (can easily view the map).
Step 2: AND GET A FREGGIN BLENDER.
Step 3: AND GET HEROES V heroes battle system (heroes have turns).
STEP 4: and HIT THE DAMN BLENDING BUTTON.

Here's an even easier one:
Step 1: Take H5.
Step 2: Iron out the bugs
Step 3: Make the factions correct for the time
Step 4: Add two hero types for each faction

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Postby Thorsson » Sep 3 2010, 20:33

Here's my recipe:

1. Take HoMM 2
2. Update Graphics
3. Add full multiplayer

Perfect.

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Postby Tress » Sep 3 2010, 20:40

While old Homm have their charm I doubt that turning them 3d would be huge success. Firstly people who like old homm would just play original just for their pace. Secondly any gaming series must evolve to keep competitive.

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Postby ketchua » Sep 4 2010, 0:05

Here's my recipe:

1. Take HoMM2/3;
2. Play.

If you don't like where MM:H6 is going (like I don't), complaining isn't gonna do you no good. Just enjoy the ones you like. :)

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Postby ThunderTitan » Sep 4 2010, 7:32

ketchua wrote:If you don't like where MM:H6 is going (like I don't), complaining isn't gonna do you no good. Just enjoy the ones you like. :)


Yeah, because at least trying is too hard...
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Postby Pollo2002 » Dec 10 2010, 11:15

Kristo wrote:My first impression of the adventure map is the same from H5: the artwork is too darn big. It feels like a third-person view of an RPG adventure game, not a kingdom-scale strategy game. Worse, the art is substantially bigger than H1-4 without a corresponding increase in movement points for the hero. The net effect is less to do on each turn on a map that's much smaller than it appears.

This gripe is one of the primary reasons I didn't like H5 and it doesn't look like anything has changed.


I saw this in other thread.

This is not a minimum problem.
It has nothing to do with fear of change or not wanting Homm to evolve.

But the 3d graphics DAMAGE the game. For practical purpouse for a strategic view the heroes 3 graphics while more ugly, are superior.

There is a lot to be gain in HOMM evolving, HOMM 3 is far from perfect, and the multiple projects like WOG, VCMI and WT, proves that nobody believes HOMM 3 is perfect and isnt lacking features that would greatly improve the experience.

You can still have a nice game with PRACTICAL graphics. HOMM5 ended more sluggish and impractical for playing the game in multiplayer as a strategy game.

Thats the sad part, both HOMM5 and HOMM6 brought and are bringing features that HOMM 3 would welcome. But there is no way that any player liking HOMM 3 for the strategy aspect may welcome the more impractical 3d graphics these games bring.

It isnt also a hate on 3d graphics. STarcraft 2, compared to starcraft 1, has better graphics and is 3d, but Blizzard made sure that the practical puorpose of the graphics isnt lost (unlike we could argue happend in Warcraft 3, compared to warcraft 2).

Different cameras where added to HOMM5, but none is as good as the camera on HOMM3. I know many people that can´t stand the graphics (myself included) because are a hassle in order to interpret whats going on the screen that didnt happend in HOMM 3.

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Postby parcaleste » Dec 10 2010, 11:41

Pollo2002 wrote:... Different cameras where added to HOMM5, but none is as good as the camera on HOMM3...


Yes, because you played it for like five minutes at best. Cameras are OK, if you don't see something and you don't want to rotate the camera angle, there is the ALT button (I think it was it) which makes everything you can use on the map to glow. And it actually comes in use if you are not used to the camera, which happens in the first 30 minutes of the game.


And the "bigger" art? Pff, are you serious?

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Postby Pollo2002 » Dec 10 2010, 12:55

I played way way more than 5 minutes, I was a beta tester, and After that I really tried to like the game, and convince myself that buying the game and one expansion wasnt a terrible idea. So I played a lot before realizing I couldnt cope with it. Yes I know the alt button, it doesnt change anything of what I said, If anything it proves there is a problem with the graphics if you need an button to make things glow.
You say the camera are fine, there are lots of people that disagree, do you ever saw someone complaining about homm3 camera?, or how civilization or any other TBS 2d? No.
But you will find it happens with heroes 5. So its clearly not an arbitrary whim.

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Postby Thelonious » Dec 10 2010, 15:34

So basicly you're saying that we should all go back to 2D just because the camera doesn't work as you'd like?

Why?

Why can't we just keep 3D? I don't mind using a button to see all interactable objects. Though a simpler solution would be easily distinguishable interactable objects; which basicly means large, high or shining objects OR objects which obtruct view are made transparant (to some degree - say 80% or so)
Grah!

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Postby Pol » Dec 10 2010, 19:25

Basically what I would like is switchable 3D/2D mode. Simpler for strategic view and more eyes catching for pleasing my heart. One fast, one for take a pleasure of a wonderful graphic art.

Modal and easy modding engine with a good map/game rules editor. With possibility of importing your own content. Simple game and complicate game - like a chess. Thoroughly thought out. Where my mind may concentrate and heart exult in joy.

And in fact, it's not so hard. Only Ubi really does not care. They are leaving the developing company unguided. They not even telling them what about might and magic series is... and that is, what we are not used from JVC.

He cared, they not. They have everything but lack good idea and will to make it happen. :(

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Postby Mirez » Dec 10 2010, 19:40

h5 had a classic view mode, you can see everything pretty clear
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Postby Pol » Dec 10 2010, 19:57

I really don't bet that it was:
"Thoroughly thought out."

H6 sounds like that it will be completely without it.
Last edited by Pol on Dec 11 2010, 9:59, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Pollo2002 » Dec 11 2010, 3:46

Mirez wrote:h5 had a classic view mode, you can see everything pretty clear


I tried the mode, is barely better than the other modes.

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Postby MattII » Dec 11 2010, 7:24

Kristo stated the exact problem in a couple of sentences:
My first impression of the adventure map is the same from H5: the artwork is too darn big. It feels like a third-person view of an RPG adventure game, not a kingdom-scale strategy game.

Solve the scale issue (by making the scales like they were in H1-3), and you've solved the whole map-view issue, IMO.

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Postby ThunderTitan » Dec 12 2010, 13:23

But then you couldn't see all the shiny 3D as well... (not without zooming in, and we all know no one does that :rolleyes:)
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Postby MattII » Dec 12 2010, 19:12

Well, H4 scale then, but seriously, heroes have to be a lot taller than the trees.


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