Heroes 3 modding tools?

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MeCho
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Heroes 3 modding tools?

Postby MeCho » Aug 16 2013, 2:36

I want to make Town Portal at Expert to only work once per day and mass Spells at Expert to be weaker then on Advanced or atleast edit unit stats and cost is there some modding tools available? I only found WCMI that suggests that it can be used to mode but i fail to see how.... i also want it to be relatively easy as i dont know any programming languages and such

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GreatEmerald
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Postby GreatEmerald » Aug 16 2013, 5:43

The only remote way to do that is to create an ERM script for WOG, but even then I doubt you can do that. And ERM scripting is harder than most programming languages out there due to its sheer unintuitiveness. It's nearly as bad as Assembly...

Otherwise, yes, you'd need to do it in VCMI. VCMI is the HoMM3 remake, not the original game, and it's not finished yet, but it means that you could change anything you want in it. I don't remember exactly what language you use for modding it, if there is a set one. VCMI itself is written in C++, but it might use DLLs as mods, which could be possible to compile in other languages, like D. I'm not certain of that, however.

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Postby Warmonger » Aug 16 2013, 10:07

A few words from me:

0. There are NO MODDING TOOLS for this game, gosh. No tool ever will allow you to change arbitrary property or arbitrary part of code unless you have access to source code of game.
1. ERM is worse than Assembly
2. VCMI is open and ongoing project, which means it will never be finalized.
3. VCMI uses .json config files for now.
but it might use DLLs as mods
This is just wrong. If at all, ERA uses .dll as mods.
which could be possible to compile in other languages, like D
You are joking, right?

Finally, a lot of spell and units properties can be modified just by editing apriopriate config files of original game, like CRTRAITS.txt or SPTRAITS.txt. Same effect should be possible with ERM (in ERA) and .json (in VCMI). As long as you are not trying to modify something that's hardcoded, it will be fine.

Final words: community of Celestial Heavens have no idea about modding at all and has not produced s single mod for years. If you are not sure where to go from here, start at Heroes Community.
VCMI : the future of Heroes 3!
People just don't care.

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Postby GreatEmerald » Aug 16 2013, 16:55

This is just wrong. If at all, ERA uses .dll as mods.
Hence the "might".
You are joking, right?
No, I'm not. It is possible to implement mod support by adding a dummy shared library with hooks, which the end users could replace with their own "mod" library, written in any language they want (as long as the compiled library uses the same format symbols as the game expects).
Final words: community of Celestial Heavens have no idea about modding at all and has not produced s single mod for years. If you are not sure where to go from here, start at Heroes Community.
Excuse me? There are several mods released here. They're MM and not HoMM mods, but hey :P

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Postby Warmonger » Aug 17 2013, 10:02

It is possible to implement mod support by adding a dummy shared library with hooks, which the end users could replace with their own "mod" library, written in any language they want (as long as the compiled library uses the same format symbols as the game expects).
Can you prove that's actually possible, providing at least one example of mod done that way?

Do you know at least one programmer who actually wrote anything in D language?

We are talking about real solutions for people who want to mod without many years experience in programming, especially in unused languages. I don't think think that MeCho has any idea what hooks and symbols are, anyway.
VCMI : the future of Heroes 3!
People just don't care.

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Postby GreatEmerald » Aug 17 2013, 17:41

Can you prove that's actually possible, providing at least one example of mod done that way?

Do you know at least one programmer who actually wrote anything in D language?

We are talking about real solutions for people who want to mod without many years experience in programming, especially in unused languages. I don't think think that MeCho has any idea what hooks and symbols are, anyway.
Unreal Engine 4 will work in a similar fashion.

Yes. D is my primary language, and it's not as unpopular as you may think. It's basically C# done right, and it's used in production by several companies. One of them uses D as the modding/LD interface language, too.

And no, you don't need many years of experience for that. Not more than you need to learn to use Lua or so. It's not ERM and it's not Assembly.

But we're not talking about anything here anyway. You already said that you can't mod VCMI aside from changing configuration (in JSON format) or recompiling the binaries, and that's fair enough.

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Postby Salamandre » Aug 17 2013, 20:18

Hey, erm is not so hard. I could reach a decent level and I am a total noob in computers languages or mathematics as well. Even if it not very intuitive, there is a huge database of mods/maps which can help learning it faster on the fly. However I have zero experience with other languages thus can hardly compare.

BUT: I player a lot of popular games using them and having a huge mods database: Civ, Morrowind, oblivion; and my verdict is that they are very far behind what erm allows as customization.
0. There are NO MODDING TOOLS for this game, gosh.
Well, depends on definition. Def tool, def maker, MM archive, erm scripter are modding tools. Now for the coding part, there are no ready templates indeed. I recall a few users attempts to create erm templates but did not hear long from them. So must do it the hard way.

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Postby MeCho » Aug 18 2013, 22:48

So to summarize and clarify can i at least change unit stats and cost without having to study programming languages as for the .json files i dont know how i even open them not to mention about editing them

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Postby GreatEmerald » Aug 19 2013, 6:36

You can definitely change stats in WOG/ERA using ERM. Possibly also by changing *TRAITS.TXT in the vanilla game as well. As for JSON files, they are simple text files you can open with things like Notepad or Geany. They're pretty much like .ini files. Here's an example: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JSON#Data_ ... nd_example


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