Best Strategy Game?

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Best Strategy Game?

Postby mr.hackcrag » Nov 19 2010, 19:58

What do you guys think are the best turn-based strategy games that you have ever played for the PC? I'm looking for something new to play, but truly great games are few and far between.

I consider the greatest turn-based strategy games (on the PC) to be HoMM 3 and Age of Wonders 2.

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Postby Metathron » Nov 20 2010, 1:08

For me it's HoMM II and IV, and the new King's Bounty series.

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Postby mr.hackcrag » Nov 20 2010, 4:41

I'm surprised you remember me; it's been so long.

Yes, I actually remember having way more fun with HoMM II than any other HoMM, but I chose III because of updated game mechanics. Nontheless, HoMM II was a lot more special to me than HoMM III.

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Postby TheUndeadKing » Nov 20 2010, 10:15

Civilization II.
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Postby ThunderTitan » Nov 21 2010, 19:53

chess... :tongue:
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Postby Qurqirish Dragon » Nov 22 2010, 14:28

ThunderTitan wrote:chess... :tongue:


Assuming you mean computerized chess, I never liked them. Either the computer was pathetic, and I could whip it always, or it was (effectively for me) a grandmaster and I never stood a chance. I never found a chess program which had a difficulty setting where I was challenged but not overmatched.

If you are talking about board-game chess, then there are many other board games I much prefer for a strategy game, but my favorite really depends on my mood at the time (light or heavy game, pickup & deliver vs. resource managemnet vs. worker placement style, &c.)
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Postby ThunderTitan » Nov 22 2010, 18:47

Really... do tell.

Which ones exactly?
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Postby Metathron » Nov 23 2010, 3:34

TheUndeadKing wrote:Civilization II.


That would be my third choice.
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Postby Qurqirish Dragon » Nov 23 2010, 14:35

ThunderTitan wrote:Really... do tell.

Which ones exactly?


light pick-up-and-deliver / train: Ticket to Ride (any version except Marklin)
moderate pick-up-and-deliver / train: Power Grid
heavy pick-up-and-deliver / train: {Age of} Steam
light worker placement: Egezia
heavy worker placement: Caylus
easier cooperative: Pandemic
harder cooperative: Ghost Stories
heavy cooperative: Battlestar Galactica

Not much in the resource management area currently, but my preferences tend to change every few months- and I also like new stuff ;-)

I'm not saying chess is bad, I just don't care for it- probably because it has been analyzed to death.
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Postby Humakt » Nov 24 2010, 22:26

For tbs I'd say Jagged Alliance 2, Fantasy General, Civilization 4 (5 if they fix the poor combat AI) and Heroes of Might and Magic 4 as best HoMM.

As for rts the best two are Supreme Commander and StarCraft 2.

If I had to choose one I'd probably go with Jagged Alliance 2.

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Postby ThunderTitan » Nov 25 2010, 7:42

Qurqirish Dragon wrote:
light pick-up-and-deliver / train: Ticket to Ride (any version except Marklin)
moderate pick-up-and-deliver / train: Power Grid
heavy pick-up-and-deliver / train: {Age of} Steam
light worker placement: Egezia
heavy worker placement: Caylus
easier cooperative: Pandemic
harder cooperative: Ghost Stories
heavy cooperative: Battlestar Galactica


Now all i have to do is find someone to play boardgames with...

Qurqirish Dragon wrote:I'm not saying chess is bad, I just don't care for it- probably because it has been analysed to death.


And that's why it's objectively the best...

But it's too formula based for me... i prefer some chance in my strategy games... planning for that is way more strategic imo.
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Postby Qurqirish Dragon » Nov 25 2010, 13:38

ThunderTitan wrote:
Qurqirish Dragon wrote:
light pick-up-and-deliver / train: Ticket to Ride (any version except Marklin)
moderate pick-up-and-deliver / train: Power Grid
heavy pick-up-and-deliver / train: {Age of} Steam
light worker placement: Egezia
heavy worker placement: Caylus
easier cooperative: Pandemic
harder cooperative: Ghost Stories
heavy cooperative: Battlestar Galactica


Now all i have to do is find someone to play boardgames with...


I don't know where you are from, but you should be able to find a group. Are there any gaming stores near you- they often have their own groups, or groups they support / endorse.
For example, by me is the Eastern Pennsylvania Gaming Society, and there are several games stores that offer discounts to members.
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Postby Angelspit » Nov 25 2010, 16:27

ThunderTitan wrote:Now all i have to do is find someone to play boardgames with...

That's the toughest part. I'm currently training my son for strategy game sessions a couple of years from now. He's quite good at Snakes and Ladders already.
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Postby mr.hackcrag » Nov 26 2010, 1:07

ThunderTitan wrote:chess... :tongue:


But you didn't say which computer chess game is the best. :disagree:

ThunderTitan wrote: Now all i have to do is find someone to play boardgames with:


Ask your sweetheart. That should be a very romantic board game. ;)

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Postby ThunderTitan » Nov 30 2010, 18:32

mr.hackcrag wrote:
ThunderTitan wrote:chess... :tongue:


But you didn't say which computer chess game is the best. :disagree:


Because playing against another human is the only good way to play chess...

mr.hackcrag wrote:Ask your sweetheart. That should be a very romantic board game. ;)


If i had one atm you really think i'd be thinking about boardgames?!
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Postby OliverFA » Feb 24 2011, 12:10

HoMM3 is a very good game. I still play it from time to time after 12 years. But IMHO it lacks a few things that would make it an even better Fantasy TBS game:

- Research
- Upkeep (both in army and town buildings)
- Storage room (so you can't just acumulate infinite resources. You need to have place to store them)
- some way to limit army size (like leadership)
- Creature experience
- Enchantments
- Heroes in battle
- Town conversion

Could be interesting but not sure:
- Diplomacy
- Alternative way to win (not always kill everyone)
- Ability to found cities (if not anywhere, at some places).

In my opinion, the best Fantasy TBS right now is Age of Wonders: Shadow Magic. Unfortunatelly it doesn't look like there will ever ve an AoW3 :(

Elemental: War of Magic looks very promising. An unfinished game right now, but they will eventually finish it, and turn it into an amazing game.

It's only tactics and no strategy, but Kings Bounty is very good, and story-wise it has all the essence of the early HOMMs (up to 4).

VCMI, The project to rebuild WoG also looks very interesting. I do hope that the team manages to finish the game and are hired by someone (maybe to work in a strategy game in Kings Bounty world?).

I recently tested Magic The Gathering: Tactics. Looks like a very good game, but has two very big flaws. First, the one who spends the most money in his army wins (and I mean LOTS of money). Second, the single player campaigns are a joke (no AI).

Out of the fantasy world, the absolute winner is Civilization IV. Civ V is a dumbed down version that requieres a supercomputer to be played. And in case it wasn't enough, it requieres Steam...

Paradox games are difficult to learn, but fun to play once you manage to get into. Specially Europa Universalis 3. The main con about Paradox Games is that they simulate the "real" world and have nothing like campaigns, scenarios, or anything that makes the game more structured and easy to play.

Supreme Ruler is another game that will be great some day but not now. The 2010 and 2020 versions are interesting, but not there yet. Maybe they will manage to make an interesting game with the third installment, Supreme Ruler Cold War.

And of course there is Heroes VI...

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Postby ThunderTitan » Feb 24 2011, 16:24

OliverFA wrote:- some way to limit army size (like leadership)
- Creature experience


Yes, why not make hero level or whatever else determines leadership the most important factor in a battle, while also giving another advantage to the higher lvl hero in that he would also have the higher level creatures in it's army...



It's only tactics and no strategy,


You can't have one without the other unless you're giving out orders at random/blindly... but i get what you mean.
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Postby OliverFA » Feb 25 2011, 8:48

ThunderTitan wrote:
OliverFA wrote:- some way to limit army size (like leadership)
- Creature experience


Yes, why not make hero level or whatever else determines leadership the most important factor in a battle, while also giving another advantage to the higher lvl hero in that he would also have the higher level creatures in it's army...


I think it's already invented. Designers would not need to think much. Assign some leadership per level and create a new leadership skill that enhances this stat. Then heroes could also evolve through the commanding path.

ThunderTitan wrote:
It's only tactics and no strategy,


You can't have one without the other unless you're giving out orders at random/blindly... but i get what you mean.
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Postby ThunderTitan » Feb 25 2011, 18:12

OliverFA wrote:

Yes, why not make hero level or whatever else determines leadership the most important factor in a battle, while also giving another advantage to the higher lvl hero in that he would also have the higher level creatures in it's army...


I think it's already invented. Designers would not need to think much. Assign some leadership per level and create a new leadership skill that enhances this stat. Then heroes could also evolve through the commanding path.


Yeah, i think you missed my point... leadership would give too much of an advantage the the hero with the higher level and who invested more points into it because he'd always have more creatures....
Last edited by ThunderTitan on Feb 25 2011, 18:56, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby OliverFA » Feb 25 2011, 18:54

As usual, it would have to be balanced. I think this thread is not a place to balance the potential skill (we can do in a new thread ;) ) but as always it would be a choice.

For wizards, it would be more powerful spells or bigger army. For warriors, it would be more powerful soldiers or a bigger army.


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