Tribes of the East Spells

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Angelspit
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Tribes of the East Spells

Postby Angelspit » Apr 28 2007, 15:15

<a href="http://www.celestialheavens.com/687"><img src="http://www.celestialheavens.com/homm5/images/spells/Deep_Freeze.png" align=right vspace=10 hspace=10></a>Let me open the new <a href="http://www.celestialheavens.com/687">Tribes of the East section</a> with a little information about the spells of the upcoming Heroes of Might and Magic V expansion. Some of them look familiar because their icons were included in the Hammers of Fate expansion, back when we thought a Naga town was in the work.

The description of Sorrow is still missing, but I should be able to find something soon. You can check out <a href="http://heroes.ag.ru/heroes5/add-on-2/">Heroic Corner</a> for more information, in Russian, about those spells. Thanks to evilp who sent me all this info.

If you would like to take a look at the original page visit this link:
http://www.celestialheavens.com/687
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kingcranium14
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Tribes of the East

Postby kingcranium14 » Apr 28 2007, 15:24

Hmm, they look okay, and it's about time they started adding some spells, but is this really all we get? This is all they are going to add to the game for the last expansion?

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Postby Jata » Apr 28 2007, 15:30

Translation of Russian description of Sorrow spell:
Decreases morale and luck of selected enemy creature

And the description of Arcane Crystal is same as Blade Barrier (the correct is: Creates a crystal on the selected place on the field, blocking the way until the end of combat or until the crystal is attacked and destroyed.)

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sir Aayren ili Essen
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Tribes of the East

Postby sir Aayren ili Essen » Apr 28 2007, 15:40

3 spells of summon magic. 2 of dark and light magic and 1 of destoryed magic? And where is ballance?

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Cleanpea
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Postby Cleanpea » Apr 28 2007, 16:17

The summon spells look really good! I am looking forward to this expansion

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Tribes of the East

Postby okrane » Apr 28 2007, 16:34

why the hell don't they release info in english so that everyone can read...

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Orfinn
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Postby Orfinn » Apr 28 2007, 16:42

They should have added 2 more destruction spells, lightning shield and inferno for example.

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Blackdemon13
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Postby Blackdemon13 » Apr 28 2007, 17:48

What about new Fortress, and Creatures?
when we will get ithis expansion?

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Postby Elvin » Apr 28 2007, 18:13

So it has been confirmed that they are in? Also can someone check heroic corner for more info?
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Postby Vokial » Apr 28 2007, 19:22

The spells stats:

Arcane Crystal (Level 2):

Creates a crystal on the selected place on the field, blocking the way until the end of combat or until the crystal is attacked and destroyed.

HP: 20 HP. Defence = 0.

[None]: 40+8*SP
[Basic]: 60+12*SP
[Advanced]: 80+16*SP
[Expert]: 100+20*SP

Blade Barrier (Level 4):

Temporarily creates a wall, three squares long, on the selected part of the field. The wall has additional 75% Defense from the Range and Magical Attacks and returns damage equal to the number of lost Hit Points to the melee attackers.

Duration: 1*SP turns

[None]: Unknown
[Basic]: Unknown
[Advanced]: 60+10*SP
[Expert]: 96+12*SP

Deep Freeze (Level 5):

Freezes targets, inflicting ice damage immediately and heavy damage during a certain amount of time.

Nonmagic loss increases on 103+3*SP %. Duration: 1 turn. Damage = 30+30*SP

Divine Vengeance (Level 4)

Inflicts magical damage to selected creature that depends on the number of enemies selected creature killed from the beginning of combat.

Demage:

[Advanced]: 40+4*X
[Expert]: 60+6*X

Where X is the enemt number in stack

Regeneration (Level 2):

The target creature gains health regeneration on its turn. Does not work on Undead creatures.

The creature get 75+5*SP % HP, Duration:

[None]: 1 turn
[Basic]: 2 turns
[Advanced]: 3 turns
[Expert]: 4 turns

Sorrow (Level 1):

Combat spirit reduces and decreases the success of the selected force of enemy.

[None]: -1 morale and luck
[Basic]: -2 morale and luck
[Advanced]: -3 morale and luck
[Expert]: -4 morale and luck

Summon Hive (Level 4):

Creates a wasp hive on the selected place of the field. A swarm of wasps from this hive will attack enemy creatures until the end of combat or until the hive is attacked and destroyed (The hive will not attack undead, elemental and mechanical units).

HP:
[Advanced]: 50 HP
[Expert]: 100 HP
Initiative:
[Advanced]: 5+0,25*SP
[Expert]: 5+0,25*SP

Vampirism (Level 5):

Selected friendly creature gets all Undead attributes and the ability to drain life just like vampires.

Effect 50+2*SP % of the demage
Duration = 1*SP.
Edited on Sat, Apr 28 2007, 12:24 by Vokial

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Postby King Imp » Apr 28 2007, 20:35

Regeneration as a Level 2 spell seems too low for me. That should clearly be Level 3 or maybe even 4. Once again, just like Raise Dead, they are bascially giving the hero a powerful spell without having to work for it (i.e. get the magic skill required to learn it).

All the others look good to me and I can't wait to try them out.

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Postby Grumpy Old Wizard » Apr 28 2007, 21:58

Vokial wrote:The spells stats:



Arcane Crystal (Level 2):



Creates a crystal on the selected place on the field, blocking the way until the end of combat or until the crystal is attacked and destroyed.



HP: 20 HP. Defence = 0.



[None]: 40+8*SP

[Basic]: 60+12*SP

[Advanced]: 80+16*SP

[Expert]: 100+20*SP



Blade Barrier (Level 4):



Temporarily creates a wall, three squares long, on the selected part of the field. The wall has additional 75% Defense from the Range and Magical Attacks and returns damage equal to the number of lost Hit Points to the melee attackers.



Duration: 1*SP turns



[None]: Unknown

[Basic]: Unknown

[Advanced]: 60+10*SP

[Expert]: 96+12*SP

Summon Hive (Level 4):



Creates a wasp hive on the selected place of the field. A swarm of wasps from this hive will attack enemy creatures until the end of combat or until the hive is attacked and destroyed (The hive will not attack undead, elemental and mechanical units).



HP:

[Advanced]: 50 HP

[Expert]: 100 HP

Initiative:

[Advanced]: 5+0,25*SP

[Expert]: 5+0,25*SP


<


These spells are situationaly good. Arcane crystal and blade barrier should be good against walkers before you face stacks that can do a lot of damage especially, as long as you have good shooters, but will not help against ranged troops. Assuming that there is no distance penalty to where they can be cast they can be used to help shape the battlefield, particularly if there are already natural barriers present.

I am curious as to whether to how much time wasp hive takes to act and what its initiative is. I also wonder if it is intelligent and not try to attack targets that can't be affected. Can the player direct the attack, or is it random?

I wish that there were a few spells that depended on knowledge for effectiveness instead of spell power.

Vokial wrote:
Deep Freeze (Level 5):



Freezes targets, inflicting ice damage immediately and heavy damage during a certain amount of time.



Nonmagic loss increases on 103+3*SP %. Duration: 1 turn. Damage = 30+30*SP




Looks very good with freezing (for a turn?) and extended damage.


Vokial wrote:
Divine Vengeance (Level 4)



Inflicts magical damage to selected creature that depends on the number of enemies selected creature killed from the beginning of combat.



Demage:



[Advanced]: 40+4*X

[Expert]: 60+6*X



Where X is the enemt number in stack




"]
Regeneration (Level 2):



The target creature gains health regeneration on its turn. Does not work on Undead creatures.



The creature get 75+5*SP % HP, Duration:



[None]: 1 turn

[Basic]: 2 turns

[Advanced]: 3 turns

[Expert]: 4 turns





Divine Vengengence: Situationally good. You would prefer that your troops not be killed, but killing your low level troops will prove painful for the enemy troops. Hit a stack with low level creatures and when they perish from retaliation take vengence.


Regeneration: Game breaking. Much too powerful, and only a level 2 spell so easily cast by might heroes.


Vokial wrote:
Sorrow (Level 1):



Combat spirit reduces and decreases the success of the selected force of enemy.



[None]: -1 morale and luck

[Basic]: -2 morale and luck

[Advanced]: -3 morale and luck

[Expert]: -4 morale and luck




"]
Vampirism (Level 5):



Selected friendly creature gets all Undead attributes and the ability to drain life just like vampires.



Effect 50+2*SP % of the demage

<


Sorrow: A good level 1 spell.

Vampirism: Game breaking.

GOW
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Gandalf: "So do all who live to see such times but that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us."

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Tribes of the East

Postby BlackBeast » Apr 28 2007, 22:11

Is Sorrow decreasing morale and luck of all creatures or target unit?

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Re: Tribes of the East

Postby Grumpy Old Wizard » Apr 28 2007, 22:15

BlackBeast wrote:Is Sorrow decreasing morale and luck of all creatures or target unit?


Only one creature, I hope. Otherwise it is anoter overpowered spell.

GOW
Frodo: "I wish the ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened."

Gandalf: "So do all who live to see such times but that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us."

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Tribes of the East

Postby aaelgr » Apr 29 2007, 1:54

Vampirism (Level 5):
Selected friendly creature gets all Undead attributes and the ability to drain life just like vampires.

Does that mean that the unit the spell is cast upon will be affected by Word of Light? Does the Summon Hive affect all enemy creatures, or is it only those within a certain area?
Mass Sorrow would be WAY too powerful, especially at expert level. Also, it would completely negate the need to go for Howl Of Terror.
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Re: Tribes of the East

Postby Grumpy Old Wizard » Apr 29 2007, 2:17

aaelgr wrote:Vampirism (Level 5):

Selected friendly creature gets all Undead attributes and the ability to drain life just like vampires.



Does that mean that the unit the spell is cast upon will be affected by Word of Light? Does the Summon Hive affect all enemy creatures, or is it only those within a certain area?

Mass Sorrow would be WAY too powerful, especially at expert level. Also, it would completely negate the need to go for Howl Of Terror.


I think the hive will cast one wasp swarm spell a trun until the hive is destroyed, but I could be wrong. Vampirism does look like the creature affected is considered undead for all purposes. So it would be affected by word of light but not by resurrection or mind affecting spells.

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Frodo: "I wish the ring had never come to me. I wish none of this had happened."

Gandalf: "So do all who live to see such times but that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us."

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Postby theGryphon » Apr 29 2007, 8:38

Sorrow is overpowered for a level 1 spell. Vampirism is cool but may turn out to be overpowered. Apparently Ubival has decided that Dark and Light schools need some buff, so here we are.
Deep Freeze is neat but I'd like to see more Destruction spells. Like

Firestorm: A huge fiery tornado. Does fire and lightning damage to a 4x4 area less its 2x2 center. Level 4. Damage should be somewhat less than Meteor Shower, possibly as much as Cold Ring.
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Postby Campaigner » Apr 29 2007, 11:53

Luckily I've given up on Heroes V quite some time ago since they wont fix what I want fixed and it can't be modded either. But for those who were still hoping for some might vs magic balance.....lol! Talk about getting your hopes destroyed!

This is laughably bad. Arcane Crystal and Blade Barrier will at the very best hold out one single round the first week even with Expert Summoning Magic and 6 in Spellpower on Heroic.

Meanwhile, the mightheroes (Knight, Demon Lord and Ranger) get even MORE powerful with their new potent spells! Sorrow as a lvl 1 spell is VERY powerful! The stack that gets hit just became a joke. Vampirism is a weaker version of Ressurection as an enhancement. Perfect to put on a stack that have lost units.

And on the lightside of things (oh the irony.....) Regeneration with its WAY to high basevalue will make creeping for Haven and Sylvan ridiculously easy since they wont lose anything anymore!
And to add insult to injury, they can take a few hundred of their fat Peasants/Conscripts and charge a poweful enemy stack and then use Divine Vengeance to obliterate that stack!

Deep Freeze is good though....


All this proves to me without a doubt that nival is either completely incompetent when it comes to balancing, don't give a **** or simply want the mightheroes to completely dominate.

I'll stick to a modded Heroes II (if not GotP fixes this).
Last edited by Campaigner on May 2 2007, 7:49, edited 1 time in total.

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Tribes of the East

Postby Orfinn » Apr 29 2007, 13:48

Oh Im so agree with you there. Would be great with many new spells, but with such unbalanced spells at these, I prefer the old 40 which wont ruin the gameplay.

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Postby Qurqirish Dragon » Apr 29 2007, 13:56

Campaigner wrote:Meanwhile, the mightheroes (Knight, Demon Lord and Ranger) get even MORE powerful with their new potent spells! Sorrow as a lvl 1 spell is VERY powerful! The stack that gets hit just became a joke.


Considering that typically a creature will have +2 morale minimum (creature type matching hero type), you would need to have advanced magic to to drop this to a negative position. Also, the might hero will have low spell power. If your knight is fighting my warlock, then fine, your hero uses his action to MAYBE reduce the effectiveness one stack. My hero will blind your strongest stack - it will not do anything for even more turns than sorrow lasts. Also, since this reduced the power of a creature stack, magic heroes would get more benefit, since as we know creature debuffs get stronger as stack sizes grow.

And on the lightside of things (oh the irony.....) Regeneration with its WAY to high basevalue will make creeping for Haven and Sylvan ridiculously easy since they wont lose anything anymore!

Assuming it raises troops, as with hydra. Also, it may be an expensive spell, so you can only protect one or two stacks.

All this proves to me without a doubt that nival is either completely incompetent when it comes to balancing, don't give a **** or simply want the mightheroes to completely dominate.

I'll grant you that their track record on balance is not that great, I think you are also being overly pessimistic.


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