Inferno Guide

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Bandobras Took
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Postby Bandobras Took » Dec 17 2006, 20:05

Just a quick note -- Gating has been modified; it's now the equivalent of a "wait" action and swift gating halves that.

So swift gating isn't as vital as it used to be, but is still pretty nice. Logistics is still my number one choice, but it's closer.
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Ceres
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Inferno Strategy

Postby Ceres » Jun 13 2007, 8:15

What is Phantom Force?
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Re: Inferno Strategy

Postby Saturas » Jun 15 2007, 20:21

Ceres wrote:What is Phantom Force?


It's a spell from summoning magic school that allows you to create copy of selected friendly stack. If you want to learn details about spells you can find them on this page:

http://www.celestialheavens.com/464

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Postby Omega_Destroyer » Jun 15 2007, 20:22

It's an excellant spell. Took a beating after the patches came out.
And the chickens. Those damn chickens.

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Postby Saturas » Jun 15 2007, 20:34

Yeah, sad that it is no longer possible to do gating with summoned stack.

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Omega_Destroyer
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Postby Omega_Destroyer » Jun 15 2007, 20:48

Never tried that. I just liked having 3 extra stacks of cerebi to cause mayhem with.
And the chickens. Those damn chickens.

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Inferno Strategy

Postby Saturas » Jun 15 2007, 21:43

It was a bit imba to have 3 summoned stacks that can gate, especially if you have some boost skills for gating like swarming gate or/and gate master.

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Inferno Strategy

Postby lord_demion » Jun 21 2007, 0:41

A big question: Why does everyone thing Dark magic is weak for inferno? (Not just this board many others hold the same opinion.) It is generally listed as the only magic skill to take but it gets relegated to slightly above apathetic in most rating. I think it is one of the best Inferno skills around.

1) Master of mind and slow allows you to reduce all enemy unit's speed by 40%. Combine this with Power of speed and you have just DOUBLED your troop's actions vs. enemy...
Example: Assume 10 initiative each...
You mass slow them by 40% to initiate 6. (Master of mind and expert dark magic)
You then mass haste yourself by 30% to initiative 13. More than double the enemy's init 6. (Power of speed works at advanced level)
Add to this the fact that you are typically faster than other factions to begin with (only sylvan and dungeon come close to inferno) means these ratios are even worse than my example. Oh, and the mass slow only takes 1/2 an action to use....

2) Master of Mind and Confusion effectively negates enemy ranged units AND gives all of your units the no retaliation ability. At expert level 100% of ranged attackers do not fire, and 100% of unit's members do not counter attack. This is huge! Compare that to missile deflection that only reduces a maximum of 70%. (Yes I know it lasts longer, but it is also a level 3 versus a level 1)

3) Weakening strike buffs a power you will already use (mark of the damned). For skill choices adding more choices should always take a back seat to making things you already do better.

4) Decay spell is quite a bit better than most direct damage spells. While the damage takes time to inflict it does a lot more damage over time. (especially for fast moving units). Even for slow units who are typically used to guard enemy missile units it works wonders. Plop down a decay while you attack advancing units. Your succubi and pit lords hit the archers (and defenders) with chain shot & spells. When your melee troops get through the opposition, the defenders and archers are mostly mopped up. Mass slow or confusion will also keep those missile units in check while this spell melts their protectors.

5) Finally the high level spells are just awesome: Take selected stacks out of the fight or turn them on their own masters...? Don't forget the mass damage spell Curse of the Netherworld that hits everything on the board but you. The damage even favors your demon lord's lower spell power.

Now I understand that there are some limitations: Undead, Elementals, and constructs are immune to a lot of the spells. You however can adjust. Decay and confusion might not work, but slow and vulnerability work just fine. The spells provide plenty of versatility that allows you to customize your choices to the units you are fighting. Isn't that what makes this game inetersting

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Inferno Strategy

Postby Saturas » Jun 21 2007, 1:57

Inferno being a might oriented town naturally goes for might skills rather than magic. I agree with your opinion lord_demion because low demon lord spellpower determines duration(not strenght like with destructive) of a dark magic spell, and for demon lord is easy to cast mass spells more then once in battle as knowledge is his secondary atribute. I go for Dark magic but only after I maximize more important skills that are Logistics, Luck and Attack. After that three "must have" skills you could go either with Defense or Leadership, or Dark/Destructive magic. In my opinion pure magic schools are Destructive and Summoning magic schools. Light magic School is there to boost your troops and makes them more potent and powerful in battle(enchance their might). Same with Dark magic that ,instead of boosting your own, cripples opponent's troops and thus make them less effective in might battle. So, clearly Dark over Destructive. Some will say about armor damaging effect fo MoF, and Searing fires perk, but still Dark magic has much more than that.

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Inferno Strategy

Postby Caradoc » Jun 21 2007, 4:29

I agree that Dark is the preferred magic school. However, when leveling up it is not a high priority. I am quite happy to have just Basic Dark and Master of Mind, while developing the others. For side skills beyond Attack, Luck, and Logistics, I am partial to Leadership for the Morale boost and for Diplomacy to snare sacrifice victims. Of course, Deleb will want War Machines.
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Inferno Strategy

Postby Ceres » Jun 21 2007, 4:47

I've been using 1.0 so, I think I can still gate Phantom Force creatures :) But sadly, I cannot achieve the ability or skill Phantom Force. I wonder why... I think it requires Basic Summoning skill? But whenever my hero levels up it doesn't show that skill as one of the options.

And I also want to know more about that thing that Inferno creatures are "Might Oriented". Does it mean that the creatures are strong in terms of their attack? If that so, how? And I'm also confused here coz, some says that its better to defend and wait for your oppo to come closer before attacking but some says that Inferno creatures should be fast in dealing damage.

And also want to know how to use Gating and Phantom Force effectively, like when should I use it (the ideal time to use them), where should I use it (means in what position should I place gated creatures), how should I use it (means should I use it for offensive or defensive purposes)?
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Postby winterfate » Jun 21 2007, 5:01

Ceres wrote:I've been using 1.0 so, I think I can still gate Phantom Force creatures smile But sadly, I cannot achieve the ability or skill Phantom Force. I wonder why... I think it requires Basic Summoning skill? But whenever my hero levels up it doesn't show that skill as one of the options.


It's a level 3 Summoning spell...so you need Basic Summoning skill to be able to use it. Also, you need to have a level 3 Magic Guild in one of your towns that has that spell...or find it during your adventures.

And I also want to know more about that thing that Inferno creatures are "Might Oriented". Does it mean that the creatures are strong in terms of their attack? If that so, how? And I'm also confused here coz, some says that its better to defend and wait for your oppo to come closer before attacking but some says that Inferno creatures should be fast in dealing damage.


It means that Inferno heroes are better off learning non-magic skills (learning instead combat skills like Attack and Defense), because Attack is their primary attribute. As for when to attack and when to defend...that's something you'll learn over time. There's no clear cut way to know when to hold back your troops and when to advance. There are some obvious exceptions, but most of the time, you'll just have to weigh the risks.

And also want to know how to use Gating and Phantom Force effectively, like when should I use it (the ideal time to use them), where should I use it (means in what position should I place gated creatures), how should I use it (means should I use it for offensive or defensive purposes)?


I like to Gate my creatures next to their ranged creatures, preventing my opponent from shooting at me with them. Phantom Forces are spawned near the unit you cast it on...and should be used to duplicate ranged units.

Gating can be used for offensive or defensive purposes, but Phantom Force is better off cast offensively.

Hope this helps! ;)
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Inferno Strategy

Postby Ceres » Jun 21 2007, 5:35

Thanks again winterfate! So I think, I'm wrong in the first place coz I build up my hero mainly with Destructive Magic :D. And I never had a chance to have Phantom Force. So sad...
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Postby winterfate » Jun 21 2007, 5:56

Well, Destructive Magic IS one of the preferred magic schools of the Inferno faction (the other being Dark Magic).

The problem is that most Demon Lords just don't get enough Spellpower to do serious damage with Destructive Magic spells.

Ceres wrote:And I never had a chance to have Phantom Force. So sad...


Well, you could get the Sorcery skill and then Magic Insight after that. Magic Insight lets you learn level 3 spells of any type, even if you do not have the normally required magic skill for it. :)

Ceres wrote:Thanks again winterfate!


Anytime. ;)
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Postby Ceres » Jun 21 2007, 6:05

I see!

So, Dark Magic is better than Destructive when you go for Inferno? And for Phantom Force its Basic Sorcery > Magic Insight > Phantom Force?

Am I correct?
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Postby winterfate » Jun 21 2007, 6:19

You're getting closer. :)

Like I mentioned before, Phantom Force is a spell, not an ability. So, you need a Magic Guild at level 3 to be able to learn it (and the Magic guild might give you Earthquake instead of Phantom Force. Earthquake is the other level 3 Summoning spell).

So, once you get Magic Insight, you can then learn Phantom Force (I think that's what you meant, but I explained it above just in case. :)).

Ceres wrote:So, Dark Magic is better than Destructive when you go for Inferno?


:yes: Indeed. Dark Magic spells are affected less by the lack of Spellpower than Destructive spells; most Dark Magic spells last longer with more spellpower, but do not get any other effects.
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Postby Bandobras Took » Jun 21 2007, 13:47

Jezebeth is your quickest path to Phantom Forces: she starts with Magic Insight, so all you have to do is build up your Mage Guild and pray.
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Inferno Strategy

Postby lord_demion » Jun 21 2007, 16:11

I agree that Inferno is might orriented. To me however this means the job of your hero is to make the job of your troops as easy as possible. To this effect I tend to wait a round or two to have the enemey approach my forces. (Summoning all the while) When they get there My hero has softened them up and the tropps jump the units en-masse. Killing them with allowing absolute minimal retailiation. (We want to reduce troop losses as inferno is offensive not defensive.) I even try to make sure it is a gated unit that strikes first to take up the retailiation. Inferno speed and attack (not to mention hellfile) dismembers the units in short order.
Dark magic is key to spliting up and weakening the enemy forces so they are not dealing my units more damage than they can handle, while they do thier job.

Ceres... Just so you know the idea mentioned in the strategy about phantom forces refers to the fact that the phantoms are inferno forces themselves and thus can gate troops of thier own.

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Postby Corribus » Jun 21 2007, 16:36

I disagree. If you're fighting a magic-oriented hero, and you are might-oriented. You can't afford to sit back and passively wait while your enemy has extra rounds to cast spells. You gotta be aggressive.
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Inferno Strategy

Postby lord_demion » Jun 21 2007, 17:23

Yes, if facing missile units or casters you have to be more aggressive, but if you've gotten swift gating (or better yet Urgash's call) most of your units will get accross the field faster as a gate than as a run. In addition, the missile units are 1/2 damage untill you cross the halfway point of the field. Which is better? Let gated demons pin/kill them while suffering 1/2 damage on your real units, or tking full damage on them?
Enemy heroes make the choices even more complicated... However, for the most part the tactic stands as best means to beat them without suffering massive losses. Sylvan and maybe necro are the likely exceptions. Remember the goal is not just to win the battle, but to win the war. To do that your troops need to live through the battle.


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