MMX Voting #2

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Kalah
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MMX Voting #2

Postby Kalah » Jun 23 2013, 13:03

There is a second voting option available in the MMX Open Dev blog: <a target="_blank" href="https://mightandmagicx-legacy.ubi.com/opendev/vote/view/51c4202de754b6010e000018">Music</a>.

From three work-in-progress alternatives, vote for the one you think should be developed into a finished product with professional musicians.

If you would like to take a look at the original page visit this link:
http://www.celestialheavens.com/viewpag ... 1371992633
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Postby GreatEmerald » Jun 23 2013, 14:09

Vocals in video game music. What.

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MMX Voting #2

Postby JSE » Jun 23 2013, 14:49

It seems they want to add some in-game/in-world music like in Skyrim.

I'm not opposed to to this at all -- but it seems quite irrelevant at this point. I would much rather get some information about the actual soundtrack and see a confirmation that Rob King, Paul Romero and their team are involved.

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MMX Voting #2

Postby hellegennes » Jun 23 2013, 15:01

@GreatEmerald:
Never done before, say... in Heroes of Might and Magic 2. Except if you don't count German as a human language.

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Re: MMX Voting #2

Postby GreatEmerald » Jun 23 2013, 15:14

hellegennes wrote:@GreatEmerald:
Never done before, say... in Heroes of Might and Magic 2. Except if you don't count German as a human language.


That was using human speech as an instrument (hence why it wasn't in English, and why it isn't distracting unless you are German/a priest). This is quite different.

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MMX Voting #2

Postby hellegennes » Jun 23 2013, 18:40

It's not different at all. And it's not speech as an instrument because it's not just random vocalisations, it's actual lyrics. The style is different, yes, it's opera. But the only reason you don't find it distracting is because it's German and you don't understand the lyrics, hence you see it as background voice used as an instrument.

The reason why the didn't choose English is because operatic music is usually either Italian/Latin, French or German. The English opera was never that popular and few composers have written operatic music with lyrics in English (Note that operas in other languages do exist; there are operas in Russian, Czech, Greek and some other languages, but these were all confined within national borders, whereas operas in German and Italian, primarily, were written by many non-German and non-Italian composers).

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Postby GreatEmerald » Jun 23 2013, 19:23

No, it's very different. Here the central part is the lyrics, back then the central part was the music.

Also note that this is MM, not HoMM. In MM, there is a single piece of music with vocals - Song of the Pale Lady, and that is most definitely using voice as an instrument only.

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Postby MadeOMeat » Jun 24 2013, 20:13

GreatEmerald wrote:No, it's very different. Here the central part is the lyrics, back then the central part was the music.

Also note that this is MM, not HoMM. In MM, there is a single piece of music with vocals - Song of the Pale Lady, and that is most definitely using voice as an instrument only.


I agree with your first point but not your second. Yes, when there was vocals in the music in M&M it was very much for timbre and melody, not for the lyrics.

It's strange that you would identify only one M&M track with vocals. Try these:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXFAa019sIg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVqbnGWqf6c
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x2IWkh62NJg&list=PL4473D21E713C0D59
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wl9mlJ9HAEE&list=SPF395E97444B4B24F

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Postby GreatEmerald » Jun 25 2013, 3:44

The second one is the Song of the Pale Lady. And the others, yea, I suppose they do use vocals, but they're so integrated into the music that it just doesn't stand out.

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MMX Voting #2

Postby hellegennes » Jun 25 2013, 18:11

There are even more tracks. The vocals are not... "integrated", they're just operatic and of course not in English. It's something you don't recognise so they pass off for just sound in your head. I'm not accusing you of anything, mind you. That's absolutely normal.

Try listening to Holst's "I Love my Love" and tell me that you don't find it more intrusive then the vocal pieces that MadeOMeat borught. You'll find that it indeed feels more intrusive; it's because the lyrics are in English.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sgf5dCeDgwo

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MMX Voting #2

Postby OneHour » Jun 26 2013, 15:59

Frankly, I’d rather they spent the time and money integrating Arcomage into the game rather than coming up with some (not very impressive) Tavern Specific tunes. I think that would add much more to the gaming experience.

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MMX Voting #2

Postby hellegennes » Jun 26 2013, 16:18

@OneHour:
That's completely irrelevant. How is not implementing this going to free up resources to do something completely unrelated? Do you picture sound engineers and musicians start programming? Or do you believe that they should not pay the music and sound department to pay for Arcomage?

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MMX Voting #2

Postby OneHour » Jun 26 2013, 16:55

Exactly. There is obviously a limited budget, and I feel that songs in taverns are a less desirable way to spend those limited resources than integrating Arcomage. So far, there has been little money invested in these songs. Once they hire professional musicians and start paying for rehearsal and studio time…the costs rise quickly.
It is like trying to decide on whether to spend money on “Big Name Stars” or Special Effects” when making a movie. Everything in the production of just about any entertainment medium is a trade off of the funds available.
With an unlimited budget, I’d love to have both (and a bunch of other things.) But all indications are that this is a bit of a gamble on their part and that they are not willing to “bet the farm” on it.

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hellegennes
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MMX Voting #2

Postby hellegennes » Jun 26 2013, 17:06

That's totally not how budget is distributed amongst departments. Whether they develop songs or plain music, their budget will be the same. How they spend the money is up to them, but unless they produce no music at all, they won't shift about their expenditure. Even then it's unlikely that they'll use that budget for anything else. It'll just be a less expensive -to produce- game.

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Postby MadeOMeat » Jun 27 2013, 12:22

If the departmental budgets are fixed (which I don't think we can be certain of but never mind that) I would prefer that the music department spent the money on hiring King and Romero and make a soundtrack that sounds like Might and Magic. Tavern songs are almost always awful and money won't make them better. Did you hear the ones in Skyrim? Embarrassing stuff.

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MMX Voting #2

Postby OneHour » Jun 27 2013, 13:22

Hmm… Okay… If you say so. I know it works that way with Government Bureaucracies, but I thought private businesses had more flexibility. The ones that I worked for did, but I never worked for a software company.
Thanks for clarifying that.

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MMX Voting #2

Postby hellegennes » Jun 27 2013, 13:32

Why doesn't anyone mention Steve Baca, ever?

Anyway, who said Romero and King are not working on MMX? We don't have any info on that as far as I know.

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Re: MMX Voting #2

Postby MadeOMeat » Jun 27 2013, 13:39

hellegennes wrote:Why doesn't anyone mention Steve Baca, ever?



Anyway, who said Romero and King are not working on MMX? We don't have any info on that as far as I know.


Honestly I have no idea about the relative contributions of Baca, King and Romero. Whatever they were, it worked in MM6 and 7. More of that.

All I know is that in the forums on Ubi's website people are saying that the 3DO-phase musos aren't involved. I don't know where they got that info from. I'm on there asking about it repeatedly.

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Postby GreatEmerald » Jun 27 2013, 19:52

Oh, so they are that kind of tavern songs. Explains why they're all so bad, then.

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Postby MadeOMeat » Jun 28 2013, 14:43

GreatEmerald wrote:Oh, so they are that kind of tavern songs. Explains why they're all so bad, then.


That's the impression I get. They said it's distinct from the soundtrack which plays in the background. Presumably they'd not have both going at once though. That would be even worse!


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