Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 05.07.2021]

The role-playing games (I-X) that started it all and the various spin-offs (including Dark Messiah).

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DrDeft
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby DrDeft » Jun 19 2021, 11:20

Enable the hardware acceleration mode.
https://ibb.co/X4BkRPn
GTX1080 videocard. Nvidia 461.40 driver is installed. Windows 10 64bit.

Can't enable hardware acceleration... why?)
Last edited by DrDeft on Jun 19 2021, 11:21, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby Xfing » Jun 19 2021, 11:53

Enable the hardware acceleration mode.
https://ibb.co/X4BkRPn
GTX1080 videocard. Nvidia 461.40 driver is installed. Windows 10 64bit.

Can't enable hardware acceleration... why?)
Try launching the setup app in some compatibility mode like Windows XP - I had to mess around a bit but I got it to work eventually - then you'll be getting hi-res widescreen by default

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby DrDeft » Jun 19 2021, 12:37

Try launching the setup app in some compatibility mode like Windows XP - I had to mess around a bit but I got it to work eventually - then you'll be getting hi-res widescreen by default
Yes! That helped! That must be in installation manual! About Windows XP SP2 compatibility mode.

Thank you))

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby Godwinson » Jun 19 2021, 15:46

Please . Where can I find the Controlled Breach.
On which map is that ?

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby justl » Jun 19 2021, 18:50

Please . Where can I find the Controlled Breach.
On which map is that ?
if you are in the endgame, go to ravenshore where the crystal was standing and do town portal there ... just a hunch, dont know if it is that, what you mean
Last edited by justl on Jun 19 2021, 18:50, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby Xfing » Jun 19 2021, 19:00

Image

I think the formula responsible for the generation of uniques should be altered a bit. I know there is repetition now, unlike in the base games - but stuff like this here simply shouldn't happen.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby killeroid356 » Jun 19 2021, 22:10

My mother has been playing this and has an issue where the game keeps crashing at MM7 land of the giants, does anyone else have this issue or is it known?

any help is appreciated
Last edited by killeroid356 on Jun 19 2021, 22:10, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby justl » Jun 20 2021, 12:08

My mother has been playing this and has an issue where the game keeps crashing at MM7 land of the giants, does anyone else have this issue or is it known?

any help is appreciated
I'm getting a crash just after entering Land of the Giants, right after archibald talks to you. This is with the latest game files (03.06.2021, and community patch from cthscr's branch). It seems to be a repeatable issue.

Download containing the save and error log is here. It seems to be a null pointer issue. I tried with PlayMP3=0, didn't seem to change anything.
Looks very similar to recent pathfinder bug, try this: put this file into your "Scripts\Modules" folder, replacing existing.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby justl » Jun 20 2021, 13:53

hi,
i dont know if thats vanilla mm7 or not, but:

to my knowledge the temple of light and the temple of dark were open all day long due to the fact, that you had to get the 2 altar pieces for the celeste-quest.
now it seems, them both temples get inaccessible when the partnering healing places (which were in the respective same building) are closed over night/day

can anyone confirm/prove me wrong on that?
justl
Last edited by justl on Jun 20 2021, 13:53, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby Echo » Jun 21 2021, 9:41

Yo I'm installing this puppy for my mom today and I launched and waaaait, it's got full-screen game screen support now?!

Image

I am (positively) shooketh! 8|

EDIT:
Just some quick impressions cause obviously I have to check it out too while at it :D

1. Guards in MM6 towns?! At long last?!
2. MM6 with MM8 graphical boosts looks so sick after all these years, love it :D
3. New UI placements will get some getting used to :tongue:
4. I accidentally launched a game without GrayFace patch before installing the merge and I cried a little :(
5. Mini-bug: when I right-click on creatures (peasants, guards in New Sorp) their animated portraits are mispositioned randomly (show only a head, or center on the torso)

6. One male elf from MM7 has a few stray teal pixels on his paperdoll. I fixed the one around his foot: https://i.imgur.com/XnkL5xu.png
He also has 2 or 3 free around his left hand, but when I edited the left hand file it didn't actually remove them, as if they're outside the file boundaries or sth :D I'm a lil confused what's up with that one.

7. Typo: when you're talking to an NPC and trying to get them to join they say "you're party is full" while it should be "your party is full".
Last edited by Echo on Jun 21 2021, 11:43, edited 6 times in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby Xfing » Jun 21 2021, 10:28

Just some quick impressions cause obviously I have to check it out too while at it :D
Ohhh you'll be finding plenty more little things like this :P But overall the state is pretty good already, mostly little things left to fix.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby Echo » Jun 21 2021, 10:56

I got few questions - sorry if there are answers somewhere, there's so much stuff nowadays about the merge I got lost somewhere in the depths :P

1. I see some races are not available when starting in MM6 - is that intended? Is there a way I can enable them all there?

2. Following from that - I'm a little confused about the way race-class works in the merge. I see if I pick say a Dark Elf, it can be a Dark Elf, a Knight, or a peasant. So I assume it's not possible to make a Dark Elf Sorcerer for instance? Or is this what the community branch does? Haven't installed it yet, trying to figure out what's what with the basics first. (EDIT: I installed the community pack, I see I can pick different races and they have some of MM6 classes available in MM6, it looks like a more complex system than I anticipated, lol).

3. When it comes to monster bolstering - does it activate if someone simply plays through one continent first? My mom likes to play it slow, explore stuff, get over-powered for late game. Usually ends up having several world resets and she would rather the monsters didn't get bolstered because she got stronger due to getting more xp this way - the point is to get stronger than the monsters :P If it does start bolstering this way - is there some file/variable I should edit to prevent bolstering from kicking in before she's done with whatever continent she starts in?

4. I made a test party of 5 characters in MM6 and it appears I cannot get any hirelings anymore? This would make stuff like the fix-the-temple quest impossible, right? Possibly also with quest NPCs? Did I muck something up and got it bugged?

5. Out of the several MM6 classes, I don't think anyone can get Identify Item on GM level actually :creative: Unless I missed someone.

6. Since there were no GM trainers in MM6 - do you get those skills trained on the other continents then? Have skills been unified in a way that say Sword is the exact same across all 3 games? And what of characters in MM6 that are knights and start with Armsmaster - do those trainers require travel to other continents or have there been traders added in MM6?

7. How does Light and Dark magic work starting in MM6? I see you can't learn it right away on either Sorcerer or Cleric. What unlocks them? Both promotions? One? And can they learn both of them or just one? Taking a very quick peek at the tables, it looks like MM6 classes cannot achieve Grandmaster in them? Does it change with promotions from other regions? :|

Thanks!
Last edited by Echo on Jun 21 2021, 13:14, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby Xfing » Jun 21 2021, 17:40

1. I see some races are not available when starting in MM6 - is that intended? Is there a way I can enable them all there?
Races are restricted to continents, you have different choices depending on what continent you start on. I think that was designed to kind of match the races available in the original games, or what tends to be found on each given continent. With Templayer's Unlocker mod you can play any race/class combo anywhere, even lore unfriendly combos such as zombies by default, skeletal dragons etc.
2. Following from that - I'm a little confused about the way race-class works in the merge. I see if I pick say a Dark Elf, it can be a Dark Elf, a Knight, or a peasant. So I assume it's not possible to make a Dark Elf Sorcerer for instance? Or is this what the community branch does? Haven't installed it yet, trying to figure out what's what with the basics first. (EDIT: I installed the community pack, I see I can pick different races and they have some of MM6 classes available in MM6, it looks like a more complex system than I anticipated, lol).
The comm branch probably has a bit more possibilities (couldn't tell you, haven't played it), and like I said there's also the unlocker mod. But the base branch itself actually sets you up with whatever you need, since you can convert Peasants to any class by visiting teachers for appropriate skills. It's quite intuitive, for example elemental magic expert teachers will offer you to become a Sorcerer, Sword teachers will offer you to become a Knight etc. You can get any class that way, including Vamp and Dark Elf, but you can't get the Minotaur and Troll classes as of yet I think Axe and Regeneration teachers should be bound to those respectively, but as of right now those skills are not bound to any race (so they're obvious picks). No idea if Rodril plans to address this, but I'm rather optimistic :D
3. When it comes to monster bolstering - does it activate if someone simply plays through one continent first? My mom likes to play it slow, explore stuff, get over-powered for late game. Usually ends up having several world resets and she would rather the monsters didn't get bolstered because she got stronger due to getting more xp this way - the point is to get stronger than the monsters :P If it does start bolstering this way - is there some file/variable I should edit to prevent bolstering from kicking in before she's done with whatever continent she starts in?
It's tied to your party's level, not to the continent you're on. So it will start as early as level 20 or 30 for the weakest of monsters - they'll get tougher than normal by the time your party is at that level. Of course you can adjust the magnitude of the boost, but I find 100% to be just fine and just about best for a good but not exaggerated challenge. Above 100% there's some exponentiality to the formula, so at 200% even Peasants will be reaching 30,000 HP real soon.
4. I made a test party of 5 characters in MM6 and it appears I cannot get any hirelings anymore? This would make stuff like the fix-the-temple quest impossible, right? Possibly also with quest NPCs? Did I muck something up and got it bugged?
Shouldn't be an issue, hirelings should work normally, but I've found the number you can have with you to vary somehow - I think it can be higher than the usual two from the vanilla games, I think I've had three at one point. So yeah, probably some bug. The game can still behave rather unpredictably at times.
5. Out of the several MM6 classes, I don't think anyone can get Identify Item on GM level actually :creative: Unless I missed someone.
Yea that's because only Liches and Great Wyrms have it (I think) - check out my skill table mod a few pages back, I try to address the discrepancy between the MM7 and MM8 sorcerer (and promotions) skill caps, making them all equal regardless of promotion path (among other things). It's just a small table adjustment and not official, but I find it to be fun to play. It's this post here: https://www.celestialheavens.com/forum/ ... 80#p384345

Also, there is no functional difference between a Master of 10 than a GM of 10 in the games - the best items require 30 points in the skill to identify, which 10 points of Master Id Item already provides. This could be addressed by raising the ID level for the best of items beyond 30, but hasn't been explored as an option yet. If some items required say, 40 points to identify, you could no longer do it with a Master of 10, and would instead require 14 points in the skill (or an Of Items-enchanted item to wear). It would be very little risk to implement, but sadly the same value in the game files is also responsible for the ability to repair those items, and there are no repair-boosting items in the game. That would require getting the repair skill to 14 if you don't have a GM or just spamming the Harden Item potion - which frankly would probably add to the challenge/annoyance in a good way :P
6. Since there were no GM trainers in MM6 - do you get those skills trained on the other continents then? Have skills been unified in a way that say Sword is the exact same across all 3 games? And what of characters in MM6 that are knights and start with Armsmaster - do those trainers require travel to other continents or have there been traders added in MM6?
Master trainers now provide GM as well by default. Alchemy and Armsmaster have been added too, though I wouldn't know their locations. Just discover them and treat it like an adventure I guess? :P
7. How does Light and Dark magic work starting in MM6? I see you can't learn it right away on either Sorcerer or Cleric. What unlocks them? Both promotions? One? And can they learn both of them or just one? Taking a very quick peek at the tables, it looks like MM6 classes cannot achieve Grandmaster in them? Does it change with promotions from other regions? :|
I think Priests/Wizards are still banned from learning these schools. But the highest promotion of both classes can do it. There is a gimmick though - something akin to the original classes from MM6 was kept, called the High Priest and Master Wizard - and they can learn both Light and Dark at the same time, though only to Master level. After that you've got the choice to visit the master teachers for Light or Dark magic and commit to just one path, which will allow you to GM it at the cost of access to the other one. The promotions are the usual Archmage and a non-lich dark variant called the Master Necromancer. Sadly you can't revert to a neutrally aligned class from there, but you can swap between light and dark at will with those classes (unless you have a Lich from MM7 or 8, those are understandably stuck). And that's the only way to get a non-Lich GM Dark caster - the Master Necromancer - you need to go from being a Master Wizard and visit the dark magic master trainer. Master Necros can still get promoted to Liches at Lathean's, but the Lich Jar won't disappear for some reason like it does in case of normal Necromancers (a bug to be addressed). I would also really like it if the MM6 Wizard promotion quest also worked for MM8 Necromancers (it doesn't), since the promoted class can also go up to master in Dark Magic, which the Necros already have. So kinda feels like a path of neutrality could be something they could choose. Also, it should be an option for Necros to get promoted without losing their cool and individualistic paperdolls.
Last edited by Xfing on Jun 21 2021, 17:50, edited 6 times in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby Echo » Jun 21 2021, 18:04

Wow okay, thanks for the detailed reply! That's a whole lotta stuff to wrap a head around :d

I thought the Peasant class for people who wanted a challenge of playing ultimate nobodies! xD Will check how it works, I think mom wants to start MM6 with Dark Elf and a dragon so I'll also have to see the peasant and the unlocker, find out a way to make it work well for her.

The boosting sounds a bit annoying for continent-by-continent play, so I'd like to ask if there's a way to disable it temporarily and then turn back on once the first continent is complete? :creative:


EDIT: I also found out why I couldn't get any hirelings in MM6 - that's because they were actual characters! Like the MM8 tavern ones haha. That's extra fancy, but caught me totally off-guard! :-D Very cool idea tho!
Last edited by Echo on Jun 21 2021, 19:05, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby raekuul » Jun 21 2021, 19:58

MM6-style hirelings are hidden in the Hirelings menu. This is important to know for MM7 wizard first promotion since you have to actually interact with the Golem hireling to finish the quest.
Image
All quest-related hirelings will sit in here under the usual rules. Please note that there is no upper bound for quest-related hirelings - it's theoretically possible via continent hopping to have all seven petrified dwarves, the golem, Quixote, the Prince of Thieves, Angela Dawson, Sharry, Sherell, Melody Silver, Prince Nicolai, and Emmanuel all at the same time, while still having two more actual hirelings, plus a full party of five combatants for a total of twenty-three travelers (and of these twenty-three, fourteen of them can hypothetically go to The Very Definitely Final Dungeon - the seven dwarves and the Prince of Thieves have to be turned in before you can get there, and Nicolai won't join you after you do the Third Eye quest which you have to do to get there)

MM8-style hirelings join the party directly - all party members you create at game start, plus all MM8 hirelings, plus anybody who offers to join you from a Tavern.
Last edited by raekuul on Jun 21 2021, 20:01, edited 5 times in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby Echo » Jun 21 2021, 20:39

Aye, I figured that out :) The hide/show menu is very neat, can keep it on, can keep it off.

Now what I'm trying to figure out is how to get the Templayer unlocker work on the Community Branch cause it doesn't for me. And trying to manually unlock the races and classes gives me a console error - probably because I've no idea what the numbers are for that sit underneath the class table in the Character selection.txt

Using the unlocker on the community branch unlocked the things it didn't mean to unlock and didn't unlock others so that was silly :D

...hmm, I found *more* files in the files and one is a different unlocker that looks like it would work :-D
Last edited by Echo on Jun 21 2021, 20:44, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby lightbringer23 » Jun 21 2021, 22:16

Welcome back Echo!
You'll discover all kinds of neat things as you go. I started in MM6 with 5x a custom druid class I edited to allow GM in all skills, so I got to explore lots of things. I focused on Master Air, Master Water, the two druid promotions, and a few key spell purchases in Free Haven -- then it was off to Jadame for the normal progression.

In MM6, the Master magic trainers will also train you to Grandmaster. Also, the requirements are standardized to MM8. For example, Master Water requires expert 7, not expert 12. Also, Master Air doesn't require the 2nd Sorcerer promotion -- just expert 7.

Are you checking out my MM7 Refilled alongside your MM8 Monstrosity? If so, let me know in the MM7 Refilled thread :D
Last edited by lightbringer23 on Jun 21 2021, 22:18, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby Echo » Jun 21 2021, 22:35

Welcome back Echo!
You'll discover all kinds of neat things as you go. I started in MM6 with 5x a custom druid class I edited to allow GM in all skills, so I got to explore lots of things. I focused on Master Air, Master Water, the two druid promotions, and a few key spell purchases in Free Haven -- then it was off to Jadame for the normal progression.

In MM6, the Master magic trainers will also train you to Grandmaster. Also, the requirements are standardized to MM8. For example, Master Water requires expert 7, not expert 12. Also, Master Air doesn't require the 2nd Sorcerer promotion -- just expert 7.

Are you checking out my MM7 Refilled alongside your MM8 Monstrosity? If so, let me know in the MM7 Refilled thread :D

Does that mean it requires expert 7 to get GM of a magic skill? That sounds... way too easy, lol. I would have to either find a way to edit it in files or go with some self-imposed rule. Guess my mom will like it though, she sure enjoys having things easier xD

I managed to get the classes unlocked nicely and everything's working great in my testing save. I really like the new UI with 1 exception - the status bar being on top is completely out of my vision since I look at the character portraits a lot in combat and otherwise - see their mana/hp/readiness. And the damage/status updates being on the completely opposite place on the screen is quite uncomfortable. But I don't know how/if I could move it at all :<

As for the MM7 refilled/my modling, I've absolutely no idea how to include them in the Merge without breaking everything so I don't have them in currently :P If you've found a way to include them that's safe then sure, I'd throw them in :P

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby Xfing » Jun 21 2021, 22:47

No, GM still requires Master 10. Also, the bolster function can be turned on and off or have its intensity altered at will.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 03.06.2021]

Postby Echo » Jun 21 2021, 23:06

No, GM still requires Master 10. Also, the bolster function can be turned on and off or have its intensity altered at will.
I mean, in MM6 there's no Master and GM separately though :P

As for the bolster - sounds good, where can I do it?


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