Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

The role-playing games (I-X) that started it all and the various spin-offs (including Dark Messiah).

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Caligula Wellington
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby Caligula Wellington » Jan 29 2021, 8:15

cthscr wrote:
Caligula Wellington wrote:So, when adding mods like armour, etc. In which directory am I supposed to put them? I can't find any similar files. Would it be Data?

Lods should be put in Data.


Thank you. I will try that out. Long to get myself some comfy boots and a fancy hat. ^^

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby Caligula Wellington » Jan 29 2021, 11:42

So, I have now tried to put everything in Data. But none of the armours, hats, helmets, boots or cloaks seem to exist within the game. So now I have a few questions:

1. I have the Complex Items document from the complete version. Is that one also supposed to be with the items in Data?

2. What about the text document Armor positions.txt? Does that go into Data as well?

3. I was instructed to add "mem.nop2(0x43A236, 0x43A240)" to the end of Scripts/General/MiscTweaks.lua and to delete "item330v5b.bmp" from dwarves.icons.lod. I had to reboot the game in order to start it again in order to run it (the item icons I added to Data remains). How is it supposed to look like in the documents if I have done this correctly?

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby Caligula Wellington » Jan 29 2021, 11:42

So, I have now tried to put everything in Data. But none of the armours, hats, helmets, boots or cloaks seem to exist within the game. So now I have a few questions:

1. I have the Complex Items document from the complete version. Is that one also supposed to be with the items in Data?

2. What about the text document Armor positions.txt? Does that go into Data as well?

3. I was instructed to add "mem.nop2(0x43A236, 0x43A240)" to the end of Scripts/General/MiscTweaks.lua and to delete "item330v5b.bmp" from dwarves.icons.lod. I had to reboot the game in order to start it again in order to run it (the item icons I added to Data remains). How is it supposed to look like in the documents if I have done this correctly?

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby cthscr » Jan 29 2021, 11:56

Caligula Wellington wrote:1. I have the Complex Items document from the complete version. Is that one also supposed to be with the items in Data?

First, it depends on your mod version. If you're using Community Branch 'master' then everything is already there. If you're using Base Merge, you need lods (into Data), 'Complex item pictures.txt' (into Data/Tables), 'ITEMS.txt' and 'rnditems.txt' (into DataFiles). Base Merge also requires 'Scripts/Global/ExtraArtifacts.lua' changes (some of them could be directly backported from Community Branch 'master' version, some probably couldn't).
Caligula Wellington wrote: I was instructed to add "mem.nop2(0x43A236, 0x43A240)" to the end of Scripts/General/MiscTweaks.lua

In Base Merge. Community Branch 'master' already has it.
Caligula Wellington wrote:and to delete "item330v5b.bmp" from dwarves.icons.lod.

Shouldn't be needed if you use proper lods.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby Caligula Wellington » Jan 29 2021, 12:33

cthscr wrote:
Caligula Wellington wrote:1. I have the Complex Items document from the complete version. Is that one also supposed to be with the items in Data?

First, it depends on your mod version. If you're using Community Branch 'master' then everything is already there. If you're using Base Merge, you need lods (into Data), 'Complex item pictures.txt' (into Data/Tables), 'ITEMS.txt' and 'rnditems.txt' (into DataFiles). Base Merge also requires 'Scripts/Global/ExtraArtifacts.lua' changes (some of them could be directly backported from Community Branch 'master' version, some probably couldn't).
Caligula Wellington wrote: I was instructed to add "mem.nop2(0x43A236, 0x43A240)" to the end of Scripts/General/MiscTweaks.lua

In Base Merge. Community Branch 'master' already has it.
Caligula Wellington wrote:and to delete "item330v5b.bmp" from dwarves.icons.lod.

Shouldn't be needed if you use proper lods.


Thank you so much. I will look into this. :yes: :applause:

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby Mirondor » Jan 29 2021, 20:50

Hi! Should we wait for some new patch one day? :)
This mod is the best thing ever happened to MM, we don't want it to die! :)

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby Caligula Wellington » Jan 31 2021, 5:55

I actually have some ideas for a new patch. :)
I LOVE this mod, and I keep exploring and testing it. And it is very inspireing. :D

Music "playlists", like in MM6 where several areas could have different songs playing depending on time and random selection. What if more zones had that? And what if it was possible to integrate some Heroes music as well? I have some ideas on what songs would fit where. If I only knew how to determine which zone picks which songs I could look into that, as well as converting them into wav for the loops. Is there anyone here who have made covers? I know there are a lot of beautiful covers out there, but I won't touch anything without permission. :)

Another idea is about skills and classes. Wouldn't it be wonderful if all classes where available in all zones? Those who aren't normally in that zone could simply be promoted together with another class. Like a ranger from mm6 would be promoted together with an archer (or druid), a monk with a cleric. Not sure about the thief though, but capturing the prince of thieves might leave the position free, so to speak. Or they could be promoted with archers if the rangers instead follow the druids.

In mm8 a paladin could be promoted with the knight, and druid with the elves (who should really be archers, in my opinion). Rangers could benefit from finding the troll home (sounds ranger like), monks could be promoted with the clerics/priests. Necromancers should really be sorcerers.

I think the berserker in mm8 is a fun addition. :)
In the other games they could be promoted with the rangers in mm7 and the knights in mm6.

And about the skills. It would make sense if everyone could learn misc skills and dodging at least at normal skill level. And maybe the dagger and staff for the druids could be closer balanced? Like having both of them at expert level. It would also make sense for the berserker to be able to use shields. The Dark Elf "skill" could use a new name, like ex. Elfkin, Glamour, or something else. And the elf king in mm7 could be a teacher. He is the primary elf after all. ;)
I love how the different races have certain skill bonuses/extra skills. I have noticed the both dwarves and minotaurs seem to be axe based. Wouldn't it make more sense for dwarves to have repairing instead? Considering that dwarves are famous for being skilled craft men and smiths.
If I learned how to do these things I would happily look into it. :)

Does anyone else think that mm6 had the best dialogue system? People actually reacts differently to you depending on your reputation and their profession/background. And the diplomacy skill was a fun touch to the game. Also, everyone could talk about the common topics for the area or related to their profession, and you could hire anyone. Even people without any useful skills. :D
Also, the guard profession should perhaps be limited to the actual guards. ;)
Though if the guards had the guard dialogue topics from mm6 it would make them more like people, and less like "guarding machines".

I even have an idea for a brand new class. The bard! :D
Basically a cross between the paladin and the thief. They start with spirit magic and diplomacy, and they can also learn mind magic (but not body). They can reach expert level (without promotion), and maybe become masters at second promotion. Weapon and armour skills are usually limited to lower levels. Dodging an leather can reach master level though. Plate is unavailable, and chain is limited to expert. The dark elf skill would also fit with the bards if it had another name.
Do anyone else have a fun class idea? Or ideas for the bard?


Sorry for the wall of text. I just love seeing all the possibilities here. And the mod is in itself very inspiring. ^^

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby starfall » Jan 31 2021, 8:54

I have a question, how can i alter the hit rate of my characters with melee or ranged weapons? The main problem i find with this game that has always annoyed me is how much enemies hit my characters with bows and melee, while my characters seem to have constant problem hitting them, even with high accuracy. So technically i would kinda like to mod my edition a bit to increase the chance of the hit rate of my characters. Is it possible? and how?

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby starfall » Jan 31 2021, 11:33

So i posted a question earlier, but seems like it wasnt posted, strange... I'll try it again,
So i was wondering how should i go about changing the hit rate of my characters in my party, the problem is that the monsters seem to hit like 75% of the time while my characters seem to hit like 25% of the time regardless of armor class or accuracy. I dont usually mod games so im not sure how to do this but i would appreciate any help given...

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby Pol » Jan 31 2021, 14:50

@starfall

Ah, you should seen a message, that your post is waiting for approval. As for first post it requires a human to touch it :)
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby starfall » Jan 31 2021, 23:11

Pol wrote:@starfall

Ah, you should seen a message, that your post is waiting for approval. As for first post it requires a human to touch it :)



Sorry, it didnt say that it was being reviewed or anything, also showed 0 posts in my profile... Thats why i thought something went wrong.
Thank you for the info tho, and approval... now to wait for... HEEELP!!! :D

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby cthscr » Feb 1 2021, 17:40

starfall wrote:So i was wondering how should i go about changing the hit rate of my characters in my party, the problem is that the monsters seem to hit like 75% of the time while my characters seem to hit like 25% of the time regardless of armor class or accuracy. I dont usually mod games so im not sure how to do this but i would appreciate any help given...

https://grayface.github.io/mm/mechanics/ - so increase Attack by weapon skill, Bless spell, Accuracy effect. If that is not enough - write your own

Code: Select all

function events.CalcStatBonusBySkills(t)
  if t.Stat == const.Stats.MeleeAttack or t.Stat == const.Stats.RangedAttack then
    ...
  end
end

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby cthscr » Feb 1 2021, 18:04

darkdill wrote:
cthscr wrote:BolsterMul is not a static multiplier but an argument for functions of 'Data/Tables/Bolster - formulas.txt'. Yes, each attribute's change is done by its own function. Change them at your please.

I know, but that's tricky to work with. Any time I've tried to change the formula, the effect ends up being really wonky.

Well, if you can fill spreadsheet with each monster default stats and desired stats - you'll be able to create your own formulae. Tweaking existing formulae with 'trial and error' method is not the best way to achieve anything.
Easiest example:

Code: Select all

def   HP   HP*(1+BolsterMul)
def   MaxDamage   MaxDamage*(1+2*BolsterMul)

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby safakhan » Feb 2 2021, 10:36

I tried M&M 7 and found that i could hire tons of hirelings. At original the limit was 2 person to hire. Is it bug or enhancements? If all hirelings works the game balance ruins badly.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby xyllia » Feb 2 2021, 11:32

safakhan wrote:I tried M&M 7 and found that i could hire tons of hirelings. At original the limit was 2 person to hire. Is it bug or enhancements? If all hirelings works the game balance ruins badly.


That might have been done because MM7 was unique in that it allowed you to have more than your 2 hirelings but only if they were quest-related? For example, the dwarves you must rescue from the mine.

Maybe opening the system up for those quests to function meant also allowing unlimited hirelings otherwise the quest would be very annoying if you had to stop and go back and get dwarves every 2? Not even sure the quest would even work properly if you coded it that way. Not sure as I never looked into how these mods are coded, but that just seemed like a reasonable theory as to why.

At the end of the day, if it breaks the game and you don't enjoy it... then just don't hire more than 2 hirelings. A lot of times with mods n such, what one person thinks is balanced another doesn't, and sometimes you have to have self control to not use something you think is broken.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby raekuul » Feb 3 2021, 12:24

6 and 7 only allowed two hired NPCs each, but you could have an infinite number of quest-related NPCs in the party at once otherwise (in MM7, rescuing the dwarves and working on the Wizard and Paladin promotion quests all at the same time gives you 9 NPCs to shuffle through). Merge doesn't properly cap the number of hired NPCs, likely because NPCs work differently in MM8 (all recruitable NPCs are playable characters, like in the Baldur's Gate series of games) and the Hireling system had to be layered on top of the MM8 party system.

(My only real problem was that the transition to The Shoals doesn't properly purge your hirelings, and it's been long enough since I've done a complete run of Merge that that may no longer be the case)
Last edited by raekuul on Feb 3 2021, 12:27, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby Xfing » Feb 3 2021, 20:34

xyllia wrote:Are Merchantman Daggers supposed to be 2d1+4? That doesn't sound right...


Yep, that was part of the item overhaul that comes with the Merge. Now that we have 15 kinds of daggers (same with many other weapon classes), it was my idea that Rodril decided to implement that these items should be different from each other, rather than having three identical (save for sprites, names and flavor text) sets of five items. So the items were ordered from worst to best and assigned altered damage values, and the highest tier is "artifact tier" now, found only in chests and monsters that have a chance to drop artifact/relic class items (and I think from the best ores), but not in shops. Making the damage of some daggers 2d1 was kinda necessary if you want to have 15 one-handed daggers, have them all be different from each other, but without having totally outlandish damage values, since daggers tended to be on the low end in the games (there was no such thing as say, 2d2+12, not counting uniques, the best conventional dagger ended at like 2d2+6 or some such). There are therefore 1d2, 2d1 and 2d2 daggers after the values have been adjusted. 2d1 is meant to be better than 1d2 thanks to no damage range, like you noticed.

It's not that big of a deal though, since your damage with that dagger will in practice be different between attacks anyway due to monster physical resistance. The die roll system doesn't mean that you can do any sort of damage between the range that the game shows you, it means you can do damage that reflects the facets of the die - like for example if you have 2d4 you will do either 2, 4, 6 or 8 dmg (not 3, 5, 7). 2d2+2 means 4 or 6 dmg etc. 2d1 means a guaranteed 2 dmg on every attack (plus whatever bonus the item has).
Last edited by Xfing on Feb 3 2021, 22:02, edited 6 times in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby Mortis » Feb 4 2021, 8:56

All weapons and armours stats can be changed by editing ITEMS.txt file, so if somewhone doesn't share Xfing point of view can make his own adjustments.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby joanthedark » Feb 5 2021, 5:44

Speaking of changing stats, is there a way to lower the recovery time of melee weapons?
https://gitlab.com/cthscr/mmmerge/-/commit/689ef6fd98878adede41e925d3bf2702c810ec47
There is still a 30 cap for melee and it cannot be modified lower than that value even if you modify the files above (05_MergeSettings.lua & ExtraArtifacts.lua).

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 12.07.2020]

Postby Godwinson » Feb 5 2021, 7:54

do you advice to use community master patch alone or together with rodril fixes parch ?


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