Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 22.09.2019]

The role-playing games (I-X) that started it all and the various spin-offs (including Dark Messiah).

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Thonkerton
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby Thonkerton » Sep 1 2019, 13:50

Rodril wrote:Breach riddles have been fixed...)

The bug also includes all other custom player inputs added by merge AFAIK, does this also fix the Light/Dark path selection that requires player to write Yes/No?

Edit. Just to elaborate, it's the custom merge inputs, the vanilla game inputs are fine.
Last edited by Thonkerton on Sep 1 2019, 14:06, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 01.09.2019]

Postby Templayer » Sep 1 2019, 13:54

@all
While we are at it, I would like to say how wonderful it is to see people working on this project.
Rodril back in the lead, coding stuff.
GrayFace coding the backend needed for the Merge to work + further reverse engineering the engine + upgrading it.
GDSpectra doing paperdolls and portraits.
reakuul scripting and making a better bolster monster.
Andrey being a professional betatester that no-one pays for nowadays, and collecting data...

... just wonderful, guys and gals. :)
MMMerge Tracker (= Info + Paint Tracker + Bug Tracker + Missing Features + Suggestions):
https://goo.gl/ui24Bz
Anybody can view or suggest edits.

My youtube retro channel: www.youtube.com/Templayer

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby Templayer » Sep 1 2019, 13:54

Thonkerton wrote:
Rodril wrote:Breach riddles have been fixed...)

The bug also includes all other custom player inputs added by merge AFAIK, does this also fix the Light/Dark path selection that requires player to write Yes/No?

I told you Rodril it was global in some manner! :D :D
MMMerge Tracker (= Info + Paint Tracker + Bug Tracker + Missing Features + Suggestions):
https://goo.gl/ui24Bz
Anybody can view or suggest edits.

My youtube retro channel: www.youtube.com/Templayer

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 01.09.2019]

Postby raekuul » Sep 1 2019, 15:15

Templayer wrote:reakuul scripting and making a better bolster monster.
Oh yeah I am supposed to be working on that, aren't I?
You need to install the base mod first, and then install the latest GrayFace patch on top of that.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 01.09.2019]

Postby Templayer » Sep 1 2019, 15:30

raekuul wrote:
Templayer wrote:reakuul scripting and making a better bolster monster.
Oh yeah I am supposed to be working on that, aren't I?

:D :D :D

Now that Rodril is here, there should be no problem incorporating it into the base merge, together with configuration switches.
MMMerge Tracker (= Info + Paint Tracker + Bug Tracker + Missing Features + Suggestions):
https://goo.gl/ui24Bz
Anybody can view or suggest edits.

My youtube retro channel: www.youtube.com/Templayer

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 01.09.2019]

Postby SpectralDragon » Sep 1 2019, 16:22

Templayer wrote:Reported by: Andrey » Aug 21 2019, 21:24
Emerald Island guards do not have any face pictures.
Rodril: Unfortunate, MM7 was not supposed to have face pictures of "monsters", there is no good portrait for guards in game resources, so the will stay faceless for now.

Seems like a job for GDSpectra

Oh, you mean making NPC images for Adventurer monsters from Emerald Island? That's not a problem for me as long as someone can effortlessly port the complete version/s (if you wish them to be just one) of these into the game. Black Dragon (character) NPC image wasn't ported in the game by Jamesx after all. ^^;

As for the Blood Dragon, thanks for the images, but I ain't taking what someone else did without asking the creator/s of said images first. I'm NOT compromising this mod by being an art thief. :tsdown:

As for other paperdoll/BG that I'll do, once Rodril decides what to do with ones that are already listed (them being either in the game or not), then I'll continue. I don't wish to clutter/swarm the guy with finished assets. ^^;
Last edited by SpectralDragon on Sep 1 2019, 16:25, edited 2 times in total.
Yes?

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Jezebeth Noir
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby Jezebeth Noir » Sep 1 2019, 18:58

Rodril wrote:Hello.
Also, this system would change game balance a lot, while i'd like to keep it close to original.
Once again. Vampire-mages with light and dark magic, dark elven druids, grandmasters of bow, so on and so on. Balance. :)
Sorry for my english, I'm just learning. :embarrased:

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Maslyonok
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby Maslyonok » Sep 1 2019, 19:25

Templayer wrote:
Rodril wrote:
Maslyonok wrote:I have a request: put my translation in main post, please.

Shall i add it as separate link, or shall i merge it with existing localization?

Merge it. It's a fixed version / he made corrections, etc. It's in the Content Implementation Queue on the Tracker.


Generally speaking, my version of the translation went a little further than just a fix. I had to redo 90% of the new text files. (as it seemed to me that everything was translated incorrectly! :S )
So, It would be nice, if you add it as separate link. An alternative version of Russian localization. Let people decide which translation is better! :D

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby Xfing » Sep 1 2019, 20:06

Jezebeth Noir wrote:
Rodril wrote:Hello.
Also, this system would change game balance a lot, while i'd like to keep it close to original.
Once again. Vampire-mages with light and dark magic, dark elven druids, grandmasters of bow, so on and so on. Balance. :)


Isn't that Unlocker-only, which is meant to be optional and not the standard way to play the game though?

BTW, I had a new potion idea today: Disenchant Item. It could be used on any magic item (except for artifacts and relics ofc) and would provide an option for players who don't like doing immersion-breaking stuff like save scumming for re-rolling an item and trying to enchant it again. Not quite sure yet if it should be a black or white potion though, I need your feedback on whether you think such a thing could be beneficial for the game and worth the hassle to conceptualize.

One problem would be: since the top quality item of every category is now exclusively Tier 6, not sure if it's possible to code an exception for the potion to not work on artifacts and relics, since those are also Tier 6. But I think treasure level 6 items existed back in vanilla too, and for example Harden Item worked on them, but not on uniques, so I guess there is a different flag those items have. Do you think having a Disenchant Item potion would be a good idea?
Last edited by Xfing on Sep 1 2019, 20:17, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 01.09.2019]

Postby andrey » Sep 1 2019, 20:36

@Rodril:

Code: Select all

Reported by: Andrey » Aug 21 2019, 21:24
Sometimes region gets peppered with alchemy and cheap ore upon entering. Bracada, Murmurwoods and Garrote Gorge are particularly susceptible. Bug back from MM7-8, I remember those strange things.
Rodril: this is not bug. Spawn of these items coded in orginal ingame scripts.


Could you please elaborate a bit? So there is some intentional semi-random event where a lot of random cheap stuff is generated in already explored region? What does it depend on?

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 01.09.2019]

Postby Xfing » Sep 1 2019, 20:43

andrey wrote:@Rodril:

Code: Select all

Reported by: Andrey » Aug 21 2019, 21:24
Sometimes region gets peppered with alchemy and cheap ore upon entering. Bracada, Murmurwoods and Garrote Gorge are particularly susceptible. Bug back from MM7-8, I remember those strange things.
Rodril: this is not bug. Spawn of these items coded in orginal ingame scripts.


Could you please elaborate a bit? So there is some intentional semi-random event where a lot of random cheap stuff is generated in already explored region? What does it depend on?


I also was always under the impression that this was intentional. It happens the most often in Murmurwoods, there it's quite easy to actually encounter a reagent rain. Anyway, I never considered it a bug, but rather a new feature of MM8. I think I've seen this happen even during normal gameplay rather than just entering an area, but I can't quite recall. If anything, I think this functionality should be spread to other areas of the game, also ones from MM6 and 7.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 01.09.2019]

Postby andrey » Sep 1 2019, 20:44

@Rodril:

Thanks for all those fixes!

Code: Select all

Reported by: Andrey » Aug 15 2019, 11:56:
Light Druid still promotes you even if you chose darkness. Warlock promotion for light path is now a feature, but what about the other way around?
Rodril: Same for Druids, you can choose that way if you prefer, despite your side.

OK.

Code: Select all

Verdant first contacts you when you reach any place of power, not necessarily the one that she asks you to reach.
Rodril: this is intended. She will bother you upon any attempt to cross time, untill you'll pick her main quest.


Well, for me it was more like an attempt to drink from a fountain, rather than an attempt to cross time. But if you choose to keep it, I'm fine with that.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 01.09.2019]

Postby andrey » Sep 1 2019, 20:48

Xfing wrote:I also was always under the impression that this was intentional. It happens the most often in Murmurwoods, there it's quite easy to actually encounter a reagent rain. Anyway, I never considered it a bug, but rather a new feature of MM8. I think I've seen this happen even during normal gameplay rather than just entering an area, but I can't quite recall. If anything, I think this functionality should be spread to other areas of the game, also ones from MM6 and 7.


I definitely remember seeing similar things in Bracada back in MM7. Don't think I ever saw it in MM6.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 01.09.2019]

Postby Xfing » Sep 1 2019, 21:01

Another suggestion (someone pls quote this so that Templayer can see it and put it in the tracker):

I've mentioned this furtively in the item stratification file that went into the tracker - but I think it would be a good idea to actually increase ID/Repair item caps for all items in the game. The reason for this is that at Master level 10 in ID/Repair Item, the character can already identify/fix anything, leaving the very existence of the Grandmaster level redundant. Just so it's simple, I suggest increasing every single item's ID/Repair value by 66% (rounded up to the next integer), meaning that the highest tier items will require 50 points in order to identify or repair rather than the current 30 points - making a mere Master in the skill insufficient. It seems clear that these point values for repairing or identifying an item were balanced for MM6, which didn't predict a Grandmaster skill - and were just ported wholesale without revisions to MM7 and MM8.

Masters would still hold their own, as at level 10 the player would require just a single "of Items" boosting item of at least +7 to the skill. 17*3 = 51. While it would make things easy, it would take up a ring or amulet slot potentially for something better, somewhat reducing the amount of convenience compared to now, so GM characters would have a not insignificant advantage here. In fact making the peak level 60 doesn't seem like such a stretch here either - keep in mind that "of Items" enchantments can go all the way up to +25. An expert with a skill level of 5 could already achieve 60 points in the skill with a single perfect roll of a ring or amulet with this enchant.

Repairing would be a bigger problem though, since there is no item enchantment that provides this kind of boost, leaving characters with no way to boost their Repair skill. Increasing the repair cap would therefore have the following effects if the party's main fixer can't get Grandmaster:
- Increase the game's difficulty, forcing more returns to town at later levels to fix the gear.
- The above could feel an "artificial increase in difficulty" to some and increase frustration, but personally I think the best adventures always involved several returns to town (Abandoned Temple in MM6, anyone?). Enemies that can break your gear could feel like a major rather than a minor inconvenience - retro style difficulty mechanic
- This would also provide a gold sink at high levels, especially for parties with no GM Merchant in them
- Make the player more conscientious about hardening their items!

If you feel the above consequences are too drastic or not acceptable, another enchantment type could be added, "of Repairing" - analogous to "of Items" - boosts the character's repair item skill. Then a party with a mere master of repairing boosted +7 could cover everything. What do you think?
Last edited by Xfing on Sep 1 2019, 21:08, edited 3 times in total.

andrey
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 01.09.2019]

Postby andrey » Sep 1 2019, 21:11

Templayer wrote:


Rodril wrote:


Are you sure that the manual input bug has been fixed? I just installed 1/09 update, and see the same problem in naming the dragon and in choosing light/dark as before.

Or is it because I installed 01/09 on top of previous merge rather than on top of clean GOG installation?

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 01.09.2019]

Postby andrey » Sep 1 2019, 21:35

andrey wrote:
Templayer wrote:


Rodril wrote:


Are you sure that the manual input bug has been fixed? I just installed 1/09 update, and see the same problem in naming the dragon and in choosing light/dark as before.

Or is it because I installed 01/09 on top of previous merge rather than on top of clean GOG installation?


Installed from scratch. Manual input problem is not fixed.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 01.09.2019]

Postby Rodril » Sep 1 2019, 23:47

andrey wrote:Installed from scratch. Manual input problem is not fixed.

Have you checked riddles in The Breach? These should be fixed for sure. I did not know about other spots, where problem happens. Seems current solution is not universal, and issue occurs everywhere, where "Question" function have been used. I'll keep looking into it.
andrey wrote:Could you please elaborate a bit? So there is some intentional semi-random event where a lot of random cheap stuff is generated in already explored region? What does it depend on?

If I remember correctly, it happens upon map refill, code needed just to make items random, instead of respawning same items each time. I will check original ingame scripts a bit later, and will give precise answer.
Last edited by Rodril on Sep 1 2019, 23:59, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 01.09.2019]

Postby andrey » Sep 2 2019, 0:36

Rodril wrote:Have you checked riddles in The Breach? These should be fixed for sure. I did not know about other spots, where problem happens. Seems current solution is not universal, and issue occurs everywhere, where "Question" function have been used. I'll keep looking into it.

checked now. Yes, riddles are fixed.

Rodril wrote:If I remember correctly, it happens upon map refill, code needed just to make items random, instead of respawning same items each time. I will check original ingame scripts a bit later, and will give precise answer.

OK, I see. By refill you mean respawn every 2 years (usually)? Or is there a different concept at play here? Thing is, rain of stuff happens not during the map respawn, but just randomly when entering the map.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby Daedros » Sep 2 2019, 4:09

Xfing wrote:BTW, I had a new potion idea today: Disenchant Item. It could be used on any magic item (except for artifacts and relics ofc) and would provide an option for players who don't like doing immersion-breaking stuff like save scumming for re-rolling an item and trying to enchant it again. Not quite sure yet if it should be a black or white potion though, I need your feedback on whether you think such a thing could be beneficial for the game and worth the hassle to conceptualize.

One problem would be: since the top quality item of every category is now exclusively Tier 6, not sure if it's possible to code an exception for the potion to not work on artifacts and relics, since those are also Tier 6. But I think treasure level 6 items existed back in vanilla too, and for example Harden Item worked on them, but not on uniques, so I guess there is a different flag those items have. Do you think having a Disenchant Item potion would be a good idea?


Speaking of Potions, i'm wondering if it would be possible to add functionality to the potions that temporarily add effects to weapons, such as Flaming/Freezing/Shocking/Noxious/Swift and Slaying Potions. Currently as is, they can only be applied to non-enchanted weapons. Would it be possible to allow them to temporarily add effects to already enchanted weapons, such as how Oils function in the Witcher series?
Last edited by Daedros on Sep 2 2019, 4:10, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 01.09.2019]

Postby justl » Sep 2 2019, 4:51

andrey wrote:@Rodril:

Code: Select all

Reported by: Andrey » Aug 21 2019, 21:24
Sometimes region gets peppered with alchemy and cheap ore upon entering. Bracada, Murmurwoods and Garrote Gorge are particularly susceptible. Bug back from MM7-8, I remember those strange things.
Rodril: this is not bug. Spawn of these items coded in orginal ingame scripts.


Could you please elaborate a bit? So there is some intentional semi-random event where a lot of random cheap stuff is generated in already explored region? What does it depend on?


recently i have heard (in a german forum) of vanilla mm6, doing the same on a random base too (in this case it was low level potion ingedrient stuff)


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