Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby SpectralDragon » Jun 15 2019, 18:50

GrayFace wrote:
SpectralDragon wrote:Say hello to more wonky-ass anatomy, people! :D :D :D

Thank the Ancients even dev-made classic Liches have the iffiest of anatomies, thus I can get away with stuff like this. X,DD

To me it looks like a reptile. That nose on the 1st pic. Half reptile, half minotaur.

Only way to make the nose ring stay, I'm afraid ... and bovine skulls are already really iffy on their own, thus I could only do as much as the Mino portrait head allowed me to. Sorry if I've disappointed you or others. ^^;

That aside, yus,got some paperdoll problems with the horned Lichy boy. ^^; Either make a class that has the in-game paperdoll position moved up for 12 pixels or have him with same horns as the brown Mino, which are ... really small. ^^;
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby GrayFace » Jun 15 2019, 19:18

SpectralDragon wrote:Only way to make the nose ring stay, I'm afraid

No, it has a straight hard edge of the nose, like a crocodile. I see it's no longer hard on the latest screenshot.

SpectralDragon wrote:That aside, yus,got some paperdoll problems with the horned Lichy boy. ^^; Either make a class that has the in-game paperdoll position moved up for 12 pixels or have him with same horns as the brown Mino, which are ... really small. ^^;

That's easy to solve. Minos have their positions messed up by NWC anyway - shifted vertically by a few pixels. So, fixing that would also help in adjusting MM6/MM7 armors.

Templayer wrote:e newest version's scripts folder? For a Merge that works? There is another script error somewhere.
GrayFace wrote:*Pokes the eye*

Don't have them.
Last edited by GrayFace on Jun 15 2019, 19:29, edited 3 times in total.
My patches: MM6 MM7 MM8. MMExtension. Tools. Also, I love Knytt Stories and Knytt Underground. I'm also known as sergroj.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby SpectralDragon » Jun 15 2019, 19:26

GrayFace wrote:No, it has a straight hard edge of the nose, like a crocodile. I see it's no longer hard on the latest screenshot.

The injured one? I'm blaming it on perspective of the injury-image there ... and seeing how GIMP shades stuff, the "reptile edge" is as possible as it can be and very hard to fix. Will try to fix it in the next version, depending whenever the long-horned or the short-horns version is chosen. For now, I'm taking a much-needed break. ^^;
GrayFace wrote: That's easy to solve. Minos have their positions messed up by NWC anyway - shifted vertically by a few pixels. So, fixing that would also help in adjusting armors.

You can then work with Rodril in adjusting this, as I have no idea when it comes to coding, like I've said. "Source" images of the Mino Lich (aka RGB .pngs) still have the original long-horned version of the paperdoll inside themselves, so yeah. Choice of adjusting this or just using the short-horns is ultimately up to you and Rodril both. :)
Last edited by SpectralDragon on Jun 15 2019, 19:30, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby GrayFace » Jun 15 2019, 19:32

SpectralDragon wrote:The injured one? I'm blaming it on perspective of the injury-image there. ^^;

This one:
Image
How much of the mino-lich is hand-drawn?
My patches: MM6 MM7 MM8. MMExtension. Tools. Also, I love Knytt Stories and Knytt Underground. I'm also known as sergroj.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby SpectralDragon » Jun 15 2019, 19:37

GrayFace wrote:
SpectralDragon wrote:The injured one? I'm blaming it on perspective of the injury-image there. ^^;

This one:
Image
How much of the mino-lich is hand-drawn?

Head is heavily edited to resemble a skull, neck is edited to look like vertebrae. What I added are different eyes, teeth, horn rings, scale chain sheet at the sides of the head and horns had been elongated as well as made brighter and sharper.
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby GrayFace » Jun 15 2019, 19:54

SpectralDragon wrote:

Here's my edit of the nose:
Image
And further editing:
Image
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby Xfing » Jun 15 2019, 19:58

Yeah, there is a definite difference between the skull shapes now. Good work there, Grayface!

I'm keen to try this ASAP, especially with the new voices. Once this is implemented, I believe there's little reason not to unlock mino sorcerers in the base game, rather than just the unlocker mod? Spellcasting minos are quite lore-friendly after all.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby SpectralDragon » Jun 15 2019, 20:02

GrayFace wrote:
SpectralDragon wrote:

Here's my edit of the nose:
Image
And further editing:
Image


You have my seal of approval there, that looks just right. :tsup: Once I'll return back onto my laptop, I'll make sure to swap the old one with this new one unless you wish to swap it yourself when editing and preparing/porting the stuff into the game together with Rodril, as both "source" files and the short-horned game-ported zips are still in my thread as well as in (methinks) Templayer's Tracker (Implementation Queue). Those can be then implemented into the mod as well ...
... and I thank you as well. :hug:
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby SpectralDragon » Jun 15 2019, 20:08

Xfing wrote:Yeah, there is a definite difference between the skull shapes now. Good work there, Grayface!

I'm keen to try this ASAP, especially with the new voices. Once this is implemented, I believe there's little reason not to unlock mino sorcerers in the base game, rather than just the unlocker mod? Spellcasting minos are quite lore-friendly after all.


Shame that the game itself doesn't allow it at all, thus yeah, forced to do this via Unlocker and all. ^^;
I'm eager just as much as you are as soon as both new voices and all new things said in Templayer's Implementation Queue of the Tracker are in (I hope so!) ... and as for Mino Liches, I can prepare the .zips again, but I'll leave them as just "source" this time, so that I don't bug Rodril (and Jamesx!) with them. There's still a thing whenever or not it'll be the long-horned or the short-horned version that'll go into the game after all, short-horned being made in order to not make Rodril and co. busy with creating a special spot in the game just for a Mino paperdoll that is 12 pixels taller than it's supposed to be, which is the said long-horned version of the Lichy boy ... ^^;
Last edited by SpectralDragon on Jun 15 2019, 20:09, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby Xfing » Jun 15 2019, 20:24

SpectralDragon wrote:Shame that the game itself doesn't allow it at all, thus yeah, forced to do this via Unlocker and all. ^^;


Maybe not now, but if it was possible to make Mino knights and dark elf wizards etc etc, I don't think it should be a problem for Rodril to also get mino sorcerers into the game eventually?

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby Jamesx » Jun 15 2019, 20:29

Hi!))
I just started a solo walkthrough with this mod... :wall: yeah, I know it's insane, so I took 2 characters for begin actually :D :D
When I played solo in original games I have to kill all characters except the one and walk with 3 corpses on my back to keep the inventory capacity. Now I thought, is there any way to make a null playable race for solo, that would be available in character selection menu? It should be a character with empty portrait with any condition, that not allows it to get exp points etc.? I think it would be useful for solo players :-D :-D :-D
To be honest the one thing, that useful in such a characters is their inventory, so.. maybe there is a way to get additional inventory on empty slots without any character?
Btw, I finally tryed a new Greyface patch with Hight Resolution and new UI.. It's fantastic!!! :-D :-D :-D Great job! I can't even imagine what have you did to make this old game show such a nice rendering :applause:

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby SpectralDragon » Jun 15 2019, 20:34

Jamesx wrote:Hi!))
I just started a solo walkthrough with this mod... :wall: yeah, I know it's insane, so I took 2 characters for begin actually :D :D
When I played solo in original games I have to kill all characters except the one and walk with 3 corpses on my back to keep the inventory capacity. Now I thought, is there any way to make a null playable race for solo, that would be available in character selection menu? It should be a character with empty portrait with any condition, that not allows it to get exp points etc.? I think it would be useful for solo players :-D :-D :-D
To be honest the one thing, that useful in such a characters is their inventory, so.. maybe there is a way to get additional inventory on empty slots without any character?
Btw, I finally tryed a new Greyface patch with Hight Resolution and new UI.. It's fantastic!!! :-D :-D :-D Great job! I can't even imagine what have you did to make this old game show such a nice rendering :applause:

I only hope it won't be too much hassle for you if I make new "source" zips with redone portrait (check GrayFace's post) there of both long-horned and short-horned versions of the Mino Lich. I really don't wish to be annoying and all. ^^;;;

That aside, good luck with the playthru! :tsup:
Xfing wrote:Maybe not now, but if it was possible to make Mino knights and dark elf wizards etc etc, I don't think it should be a problem for Rodril to also get mino sorcerers into the game eventually?

Only time will tell. ^^;
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby Jamesx » Jun 15 2019, 20:45

SpectralDragon wrote:I only hope it won't be too much hassle for you if I make new "source" zips with redone portrait (check GrayFace's post) there of both long-horned and short-horned versions of the Mino Lich. I really don't wish to be annoying and all. ^^;;;

That aside, good luck with the playthru! :tsup:

:D Don't worry about that, it's not so hard actually)) hardest part of this work was done when I finished one of my first port. After that I make a special sample file, that makes porting much easier))) ;)
Thanks, hope I have enough of patience to complete all 3 stories)) :D

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby SpectralDragon » Jun 15 2019, 20:50

Jamesx wrote::D Don't worry about that, it's not so hard actually)) hardest part of this work was done when I finished one of my first port. After that I make a special sample file, that makes porting much easier))) ;)
Thanks, hope I have enough of patience to complete all 3 stories)) :D

Ok, thanks ... and speaking of conversions, you can also do that yourself now by just downloading GrayFace's edited portrait there, then busting open the "source" files I sent ya (be it short-horn or long-horn) and swap the aforementioned portrait it swaps with the one that GrayFace edited. ;) The portrait number is between 40 and 43, probably either 40 or 42. ;)
Ditto as well, ha ha ha ha ha! I'll go test the Merge once stuff from Content Implementation Queue of Templayer's Tracker will be in like custom voices for Liches, Zombies and some fixes, as I wish to play as Unlocked Ghost Dragon with his own special voice that Templayer made. :D
Last edited by SpectralDragon on Jun 15 2019, 20:51, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby Templayer » Jun 15 2019, 21:11

GUYS. I actually found out that Liches in MM CAN be zombies! This is from NWC themselves:

"The closest the Necromancers have come to a resurrection is the creation of the Lich. The Lich itself is not evil - it is merely the attempt of a mage to keep himself alive after his death by *trading* his life for his own resurrection. Far more sentient than the animated Zombies or Skeletons, the Lich retains the abilities of its previous form, but must continue to feed on life to survive."

"Far more sentient than the animated Zombies or Skeletons"

https://mightandmagic.fandom.com/wiki/Necromancy_origin

I found this stuff while doing my gigantic lore research for the complex name generator project.
MMMerge Tracker (= Info + Paint Tracker + Bug Tracker + Missing Features + Suggestions):
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Anybody can view or suggest edits.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby Xfing » Jun 15 2019, 21:25

Templayer wrote:GUYS. I actually found out that Liches in MM CAN be zombies! This is from NWC themselves:

"The closest the Necromancers have come to a resurrection is the creation of the Lich. The Lich itself is not evil - it is merely the attempt of a mage to keep himself alive after his death by *trading* his life for his own resurrection. Far more sentient than the animated Zombies or Skeletons, the Lich retains the abilities of its previous form, but must continue to feed on life to survive."

"Far more sentient than the animated Zombies or Skeletons"

https://mightandmagic.fandom.com/wiki/Necromancy_origin

I found this stuff while doing my gigantic lore research for the complex name generator project.


Yeah, that doesn't mean a lich can be a zombie. A lich is resurrected, while a zombie and a skeleton are just animated, with minimal sentience.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby toreadorlelder » Jun 16 2019, 0:52

Problem in the Breach. Had a 5 char party; found 3 of the 4 (at places noted earlier in the thread) but can't find #5. Telelocator suggest "Old Loeb's Cave"...but I've checked the entire map, as much as I can...the reflecting thing is a royal PITA. Haven't figured out how to get into the fortress in the middle, or any of the towers in the SW corner.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby SpectralDragon » Jun 16 2019, 6:57

SpectralDragon wrote:
SpectralDragon wrote:Let me be brief this time, everyone.

:D :D Minotaur Lich is complete! :D :D

After what I´ve learned from processing Mino Zombie, I took heed of everything and acted accordingly. Consider these files to be "source", still needing to be ported into the game proper. GIMP (or at least the version I have) is like that, unfortunately.


:stop: WARNING!! :stop:
I´ve got return info from Jamesx that seeing how the paperdoll of this is bigger than what the game intended (HORNS), it´s the case of either Rodril fixing its paperdoll position OR me making his horns as small as original Brown Minotaur has. Link will still contain original paperdoll with its full horns for Rodril/other coders to mess with, but as for now, it´s currently unusable until its paperdoll position has been fixed in order to fit with armors of the paperdoll.

So yeah, smaller horns or more dabbling with the paperdoll itself from coders´ side? The choice is yours now, as I made the smaller-horned one just in case you pals wish to not mess with this paperdoll anymore. So yeah. ^^;


Links to "source" Minotaur Lich files had been changed and updated accordingly! Thank you, GrayFace and co. (like Templayer and Jamesx!) for letting me know about wrong stuff regarding both the paperdoll and portraits! :hug: :hail:
Image
:down: LINKS: :down:
Source files for the big-horned Minotaur Lich paperdoll for devs to tweak in order to fix the position it˙s in
Source files for the small-horned Minotaur Lich that causes no problems to the paperdoll positions in the game

Good Luck!
Last edited by SpectralDragon on Jun 16 2019, 7:35, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby SpectralDragon » Jun 16 2019, 7:27

Roticet wrote:
Templayer wrote:I mean yellow with a black core could look nice for them. :P


If we are talking eyes still, one question. Is the ragdoll big enough to show yellow with a black core? If so, I agree that would be cool. But I'm not sure it will be. But then again, Spectral Dragon has been doing some pretty sweet work with the various models he has come up with. Maybe he can get it to work.

This is for both of you to see how would that look like and it´s just of informative nature.
Image
Image

Sadly I´m not impressed.
Xfing wrote:Yeah, that doesn't mean a lich can be a zombie. A lich is resurrected, while a zombie and a skeleton are just animated, with minimal sentience.

Thus I˙ve suggested Ghosts as characters instead of Bare Skeletons, even if it means a whole slew of new problems, mainly the equipment ... and yus, I had a Lich Ghost show up in my dream once, thus I wonder if I should try get that in as well, no matter how senseless it is (since technically a Lich Ghost is possible whenever you approach his/her phylactery, as his/her soul might come out of it to defend it or something).
Image
Be very afraid. I saw this when I was like 13-15 years old. :D

:devious: Which reminds me, since Dragons become Ghost Dragons if you zombify them in-game due to Zombie Dragons not being a thing in MM lore, what happens if you try to zombify a Lich or a Vampire? My answer: Ghost Liches and Ghost Vampires! :D :D :D
Last edited by SpectralDragon on Jun 16 2019, 7:56, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 10.06.2019]

Postby Templayer » Jun 16 2019, 7:57

Xfing wrote:Yeah, that doesn't mean a lich can be a zombie. A lich is resurrected, while a zombie and a skeleton are just animated, with minimal sentience.

A resurrected as "what" is the question. If Liches couldn't be enhanced zombies, only enhanced skeletons, then zombies wouldn't have been mentioned in that sentence.
MMMerge Tracker (= Info + Paint Tracker + Bug Tracker + Missing Features + Suggestions):
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Anybody can view or suggest edits.

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