Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine. [upd. 08.09.2019]

The role-playing games (I-X) that started it all and the various spin-offs (including Dark Messiah).

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Templayer
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby Templayer » Oct 21 2018, 9:11

Xfing wrote:Ok, so now on to the main thing: After a whole day of painstaking work, I've created the file with suggested tiering of all remaining items.

Rodril, could you sticky this, along with my previous 2 files for weapons and body armor in the original post or something? That way people would be able to give feedback. The file's here, and I'm quite proud of my work, enjoy:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/2kqbl6zhnxb3x ... .docx?dl=0

Pasting the remaining ones for your convenience:

Body armor:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/smrpujkjatc0t ... .docx?dl=0

Weapons:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ylji9feq4lmzz ... .docx?dl=0

I've also finally added (or am in the process of adding, currently armours are added and working on weapons) the subtiering of items into the tracker.
The formatting got screwed up (even though I'm copy pasting from docx to docx... go figure. That's why people use pdfs - those always stay the same! :D ),
so I am fixing the formatting, the pictures (of the item sprites) do not want to be copypasted for some reason, so I have to add those manually.
Also I am making little (formatting only! No value changes!) changes so that it would get indexed nicely and properly (if you were to check the index and it's hyperlinks).
The syntax is ARMOR / WEAPON / APPAREL -> each specific class of item -> SPRITES / NOTES / TABLE OF VALUES.
You might be able to see me work on it in real time, if you are lucky! :D (I love that feature of Google Docs... it's like Microsoft Office with multiplayer support! :D :D :D)


@Rodril
Might I ask for a sticky for the tracker? It's decent now. :devious: :S
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby Templayer » Oct 21 2018, 9:15

Xfing wrote:
Templayer wrote:Why don't you subtier them too? Since the MM6 ones look more archaic, make them weaker and the MM7 ones stronger. :P
I'm absolutely against removing unique graphics. Especially since I like both of them. :(


That was my first thought. MM6's blasters could be weaker, as they're over 1000 years old if not more, while those from the Lincoln were in much better repair and overall looked newer. Making MM6's blasters 3d5+6 and 5d5+10 or something wouldn't be such a bad way to differentiate them.

Just make sure not to underpower them too much.
Where is that glitch with Arena being full of reactors when you need it? :D :D

Also since the subtiering info is now in the tracker, I will need to be informed of CHANGES.
(i.e. I refuse to read the whole thing trying to find out if something changed by comparing it, with my bad eyesight and all!)
Like "I've changed the longsword's notes and table of values for this and this" should suffice for the future. ^_^
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby Xfing » Oct 21 2018, 10:04

I'll need to suggest actual flavor text in the weapons file. I only suggested some loose proposals, and it would probably be easier on Rodril to have the entire text ready to add. I added full suggestions of flavor text to the shields + apparel file at least.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby dominatorek1 » Oct 21 2018, 10:51

Guys how do i give to all my characters exp xp pls can u give me a code i dont know how to do it i need help with that pls i dont know how to type that just give me the code for this cheat.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby Templayer » Oct 21 2018, 11:30

dominatorek1 wrote:Guys how do i give to all my characters exp xp pls can u give me a code i dont know how to do it i need help with that pls i dont know how to type that just give me the code for this cheat.

We do not have it, you will have to wait for someone who is actually coding the project (Rodril or GrayFace) to give it to you.
"just give me the code for this cheat." - that is not how that works. I've tried to explain it to you before. Someone has to actually code it for you (I could, it is going to be some foreach loop on the party members, changing their EXP values, I think, but I do not have the time to learn the syntax just for some kid to be able to cheat in a game where cheating really makes the player miss out on the experience...).
Last edited by Templayer on Oct 21 2018, 11:31, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby dominatorek1 » Oct 21 2018, 11:36

wtf **** man there is only one cheat for gold seriously thats stupid u are kiddo.

Mod Note: Please mind your language and behave with respect to others in the thread.
Last edited by Pol on Oct 21 2018, 21:40, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby Xfing » Oct 21 2018, 12:08

I've played these games for like 15 years at least, and never even thought about cheating. It's a single player game, why would you want to cheat? Being able to kill dragons right away will get boring for you real quick anyway, so just play the freaking game the way it's meant to instead of acting all entitled.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby dominatorek1 » Oct 21 2018, 12:16

i need just for fun omg.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby Rodril » Oct 21 2018, 12:17

dominatorek1 wrote:wtf **** man there is only one cheat for gold seriously thats stupid u are kiddo.

Here is list of all existing cheat codes: https://grayface.github.io/mm/ext/ref/# ... nformation

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby Templayer » Oct 21 2018, 13:01

Xfing wrote:I'll need to suggest actual flavor text in the weapons file. I only suggested some loose proposals, and it would probably be easier on Rodril to have the entire text ready to add. I added full suggestions of flavor text to the shields + apparel file at least.

Where exactly in the apparel file? It's 13 pages long! :D
Oh, it seems that the version that I got on the tracker already has flavour texts for apparels. Were any added in between those versions?

Also I just went and made a ton of (99% of them name) suggestions. All the duplicate naming should be solved.
MMMerge Tracker (= Info + Paint Tracker + Bug Tracker + Missing Features + Suggestions):
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby Templayer » Oct 21 2018, 13:09

dominatorek1 wrote:wtf **** man there is only one cheat for gold seriously thats stupid u are kiddo.

Reported.

Xfing wrote:I've played these games for like 15 years at least, and never even thought about cheating. It's a single player game, why would you want to cheat? Being able to kill dragons right away will get boring for you real quick anyway, so just play the freaking game the way it's meant to instead of acting all entitled.

Exactly.

Rodril wrote:
dominatorek1 wrote:wtf **** man there is only one cheat for gold seriously thats stupid u are kiddo.

Here is list of all existing cheat codes: https://grayface.github.io/mm/ext/ref/# ... nformation

At first I was like "Why are you helping this <self-censorship>?" and then I have opened that link.
There is no way he is going to be able to understand what is in that link! :D :D :D (i.e. I got that joke)
Last edited by Templayer on Oct 21 2018, 13:18, edited 1 time in total.
MMMerge Tracker (= Info + Paint Tracker + Bug Tracker + Missing Features + Suggestions):
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby Rodril » Oct 21 2018, 13:12

Hello, patch link have been updated. Mainly minor fixes. Verdant's "Guiding gem" quest now should work correctly even if you use localization. I've added two armors converted by Kristal, thanks. But i want to ask for future conversions: add pants or skirt for female variation of armor if picture does not have it (I've added for these two), - it is not just my opinion, that's how all mm8 armors works and look alike.
fr3aksh0w wrote:Hi, I'm dying to try out the merge but I can't seem to launch the game. I get the debug console with following information:

Have you installed game from links in first post? If so try to reinstall it exactly in order described there.
Skjurru wrote:Second: I would like to contribute. I've got zero skill in coding or texturing (I'm pretty sure they are prohibited skills for my race/class combo), but I'm pretty good at writing. Been doing it for a living for a while now.

I've inserted your text corrections in today's update, thanks. Only important writing task at the moment is end-game postcard text. Now it shows mm8 ending text, what is definetely wrong. Text should describe player's victory in any form and fit in post card. To test it, open debug console with ctrl + f1, type following code and press ctrl + enter to execute:

Code: Select all

Game.PrintEndCard("Your text here (in quotes)")

Game will lag a bit during printing.
Other than that there were discussions about that dragon hatchling from warlock's promotion quest. Maybe there should be side quest to "feed" him into mm8 alike dragon, who can join as real party memeber, not just npc follower. If it is interesting for you - write it down, it should not include complete new locations though.
KevinGelking wrote:I've spent 2 hours reloading the >>> Elemental Guild in Alvar (MM8) trying to get a Fly spell <<<, but I've only gotten Implosion and Invisibility.

In Jadame Alvarian guild will never sell Fly spell (unlike in original mm8), only guild of Regna will.

Speaking of suggestions above.
It is quiet hard task to add spells from mm6 at the moment, because i have not touch spell system at all. As far as i know, current version of MMExtension does not offer many instruments to edit spells, so it won't be possible to do anything without digging .exe first. And i don't think mm6 spells are really needed here.
I would leave dragons as they are. New promotion system for them have sense, but i want to keep game close to source.

Thanks.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby dominatorek1 » Oct 21 2018, 13:14

I know everything mate but i can get super master skill or i dont know how to set up this thing
-- learn all available skills at their maximum level
local LearnLevel = (Game.Version > 6 and {1, 4, 7, 10} or {1, 4, 12})

for _, pl in Party do
for i, learn in EnumAvailableSkills(pl.Class) do
local skill, mastery = SplitSkill(pl.Skills[i])
skill = math.max(skill, LearnLevel[learn]) -- learn at least the usual needed level
mastery = math.max(mastery, learn) -- learn the mastery
pl.Skills[i] = JoinSkill(skill, mastery)
end
this thing dosent work

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby dominatorek1 » Oct 21 2018, 13:18

Reported too.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby Templayer » Oct 21 2018, 13:24

Rodril wrote:Other than that there were discussions about that dragon hatchling from warlock's promotion quest. Maybe there should be side quest to "feed" him into mm8 alike dragon, who can join as real party memeber, not just npc follower. If it is interesting for you - write it down, it should not include complete new locations though.

That's why the Erathian Black Dragon is in the paint tracker. :P

dominatorek1 wrote:Reported too.

Since you do not know how to use the Reply button, I presume you have no idea on how to report posts, whomever you have allegedly reported for whatever chosen reason.
Last edited by Templayer on Oct 21 2018, 13:30, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby Templayer » Oct 21 2018, 13:26

[moved to the post above]
Last edited by Templayer on Oct 21 2018, 13:28, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby Templayer » Oct 21 2018, 16:52

Xfing wrote:I'll need to suggest actual flavor text in the weapons file. I only suggested some loose proposals, and it would probably be easier on Rodril to have the entire text ready to add. I added full suggestions of flavor text to the shields + apparel file at least.

The tracker now has all sorts of suggestions for your files, but most of them are for the naming duplicates. Could you check those out? They are made as annotations / comments.

EDIT: New suggestions on the tracker:

Headwear capability connected to skills
By Somebody on the forum, forgot who
Connecting these classes of items to these skills:
Leather - Hats and Crowns (Mages and Druids probably shouldn't wear heavy helmets, opting for hats and circlets)
Chain - Hats and Helmets (an Archer and such would wear either a cap or a helmet)
Plate - Crowns and Helmets (Crowns are made out of metal plates. Kings and Knights would wear crowns and helms)

More precise naming convention for weapon skills
By Templayer
Making weapon skill names more precise:
Bow and Crossbow instead of Bow
Mace, Club and Hammer instead of Mace
Sword and Cutlass instead of Sword
Dagger and Knife instead of Dagger
Spear, Halberd and Trident instead of Spear
Last edited by Templayer on Oct 21 2018, 17:19, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby Xfing » Oct 21 2018, 17:51

Templayer wrote:
Xfing wrote:I'll need to suggest actual flavor text in the weapons file. I only suggested some loose proposals, and it would probably be easier on Rodril to have the entire text ready to add. I added full suggestions of flavor text to the shields + apparel file at least.

The tracker now has all sorts of suggestions for your files, but most of them are for the naming duplicates. Could you check those out? They are made as annotations / comments.


K, will do.

EDIT: New suggestions on the tracker:

Headwear capability connected to skills
By Somebody on the forum, forgot who
Connecting these classes of items to these skills:
Leather - Hats and Crowns (Mages and Druids probably shouldn't wear heavy helmets, opting for hats and circlets)
Chain - Hats and Helmets (an Archer and such would wear either a cap or a helmet)
Plate - Crowns and Helmets (Crowns are made out of metal plates. Kings and Knights would wear crowns and helms)


Don't think this is such a good idea. Helmets are necessary for classes constrained to leather armor, as without them they'd struggle in terms of armor class, I think. Then again, they still have capes, gauntlets and boots, so maybe they could get by. Also, you'd have to take into account that there is always a bonus to AC from a skill, so would master leather users get +2 per skill point to armor from wearing a hat? :D

More precise naming convention for weapon skills
By Templayer
Making weapon skill names more precise:
Bow and Crossbow instead of Bow
Mace, Club and Hammer instead of Mace
Sword and Cutlass instead of Sword
Dagger and Knife instead of Dagger
Spear, Halberd and Trident instead of Spear


I think this is just clutter. If anything, amending skill descriptions to list out all the types of weapons a skill allows you to use would be enough. Then again, my only confusion ever was about clubs and halberds (thought the latter needed Axe, not Spear), and a minimal amount of trial and error is enough to overcome any doubts anyway.

Rodril wrote:But i want to ask for future conversions: add pants or skirt for female variation of armor if picture does not have it (I've added for these two), - it is not just my opinion, that's how all mm8 armors works and look alike.


This is generally true, but not always. Exceptions include: Banded Plate, Minotaur Plate, Alvarian Leather, Siertal Chainmail. While it is aesthetically pleasing, I wouldn't go out of my way to force this. 11/15 armors in the game cover the legs of the female model, so what do you say we keep this proportion with 45 armors? That would make 33 of them cover the legs. Also, we need to take into account that we'd have to use existing MM8 leg sprites, which there's a limited variety of, since redrawing those from scratch for the new old armors might be quite a tough task.

Anyway, I believe the easiest leg portions to use would be those from the Steel Chainmail and the Minotaur Chainmail. They're pretty much perfectly smooth, making it easy to modify them - both by recoloring and by putting effects on them. Something completely smooth like the leg portion of the Minotaur Chainmail should be easy to modify into something unrecognizable from the original sprite.
Last edited by Xfing on Oct 21 2018, 18:24, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby Templayer » Oct 21 2018, 20:20

Xfing wrote:
Templayer wrote:Headwear capability connected to skills
By Somebody on the forum, forgot who
Connecting these classes of items to these skills:
Leather - Hats and Crowns (Mages and Druids probably shouldn't wear heavy helmets, opting for hats and circlets)
Chain - Hats and Helmets (an Archer and such would wear either a cap or a helmet)
Plate - Crowns and Helmets (Crowns are made out of metal plates. Kings and Knights would wear crowns and helms)


Don't think this is such a good idea. Helmets are necessary for classes constrained to leather armor, as without them they'd struggle in terms of armor class, I think. Then again, they still have capes, gauntlets and boots, so maybe they could get by. Also, you'd have to take into account that there is always a bonus to AC from a skill, so would master leather users get +2 per skill point to armor from wearing a hat? :D

They're kinda supposed to struggle with those. Having sorcerers and druids wear full plate knightly helmets while in robes and leather sound weird to the logical part of my brain. The other part is fine with it, though. :D
And as any master in leather knows, wearing a hat adds to your protection. (how's that for an innuendo! :D)
Last edited by Templayer on Oct 21 2018, 20:21, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Might and Magic 6, 7, 8 merge based on mm8 engine.

Postby Xfing » Oct 21 2018, 20:24

Templayer wrote:And as any master in leather knows, wearing a hat adds to your protection. (how's that for an innuendo! :D)


No glove, no love :D


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