What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

The role-playing games (I-X) that started it all and the various spin-offs (including Dark Messiah).

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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby Pol » Jun 10 2016, 20:50

With being older you are not getting only more experienced but stronger. That is true especially where you are soldier. Remember old masters (usually practicing some fighting sport) or war veterans - like Silver Shields (Argyraspides). This unit was composed from veterans only, which means men between forty (youngsters) and seventy (or more). See theirs enemy was Antigonos, under whom they later switched and he died in another battle in his 81yrs. And he was feared on the battlefield.

So, if you have will, some luck and power, you will get stronger. Do not imagine flat office rats, that would be misleading.

The first and the second war are a bit of exceptions as there were first time used mechanized brigades and other machines, so being older, from the pre-tank ages, wouldn't help you.

So JVC could write his gem anytime until he pass off. He proved that he's having that in him. And that's what matters the most. :)

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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby Baronus » Jun 10 2016, 20:54

To hellegennes:
JVC dont fight using physical strenght. Have you ever heard about word ,,metaphore"? Ronald Reagan end his best of US history presidency in age 77. It was great victory. JVC in 77 age will can create best games in his life. In this age only body is very weak. Artists in age 80 creates best works. See Michel Angelo 89 YEAR OLD !!! AND STILL WORKED IN MURMUR HARD STONE!!! PHYSICAL WORK!
Game creation is art with zero physical strenght.

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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby hellegennes » Jun 10 2016, 22:12

Erwinner wrote:you can say all of that if you will, but, actually, I agree with the others, it doesn't make a difference what age he is here for better or worse unless it means he is senile or dead, really no point to bring that up lol


So, you believe too that creativity is an everlasting stream and only death or Alzheimer's disease can stop it?

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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby hellegennes » Jun 10 2016, 22:27

Baronus wrote:To hellegennes:
JVC dont fight using physical strenght. Have you ever heard about word ,,metaphore"? Ronald Reagan end his best of US history presidency in age 77. It was great victory. JVC in 77 age will can create best games in his life. In this age only body is very weak. Artists in age 80 creates best works. See Michel Angelo 89 YEAR OLD !!! AND STILL WORKED IN MURMUR HARD STONE!!! PHYSICAL WORK!
Game creation is art with zero physical strenght.


I said that you can find exceptions but exceptions they are. The rule is that your most creative years are between 20 and 40. There are many reasons for that. One of them is that when you are younger you have fresher ideas, you are less set in your ways and the experiences of your own generation have not been applied yet. You see, your generation's childhood defines your generation and every generation comes with a broad set of ideas and experiences. If you are 60, your generation has already transformed most of their ideas and mindset into actual works.

Again, there are exceptions, but if you have to BET, bet on the average. So far JVC has demonstrated that he is past his creative years. He hasn't done anything exceptional in the last one and a half decade.

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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby Bandobras Took » Jun 11 2016, 4:56

I wouldn't blame age so much as how badly the 3do experience burned him out; there are some things you just don't recover from.
Far too many people speak their minds without first verifying the quality of their source material.

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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby Baronus » Jun 11 2016, 7:04

Age 20 - 40 is for soldiers NOT FOR ARTISTS! If someone want create big work he must be OVER 40! 20 years old novel writer :-) Nonsense. It will be novels interesting maybe for kids... Game is big creation and creator must be experienced.
JVC in years 2002 - 2015 has no chance to create something big. It was misfortune years for his creations. Great collapse ALL HIS WORKS! Bankruptcy. Tragedy. All NWC team destroyed. They told that for this day live with things about this. That DOESNT mean that they losted creation abilities! They create beaty game Creature Quest. And as I see graphic is very good.

In respect to a complain removed first few sentences as they contained mildly offensive statements. Please rephrase from using personal attacks, if you don't wish to aggravate people. This is not an acceptable way how to support your arguments. No need to say that this also violates our forum rules.
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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby Erwinner » Jun 11 2016, 13:16

hellegennes wrote:So, you believe too that creativity is an everlasting stream and only death or Alzheimer's disease can stop it?


well it's just a form of ageism at the end of the day (not suggesting you yourself are an ageist, but yeah), I would be very wary of applying a stereotype like that to anybody,

here recommend a read of David Mullich (Heroes 3 director)'s article, it supplies some good perspective on that topic lol

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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby hellegennes » Jun 11 2016, 21:05

Bandobras Took wrote:I wouldn't blame age so much as how badly the 3do experience burned him out; there are some things you just don't recover from.


Maybe. But there's no way to prove that this is the reason. The only way to prove he still is capable of creating masterpieces is... well, to create a masterpiece.

Erwinner wrote:
hellegennes wrote:So, you believe too that creativity is an everlasting stream and only death or Alzheimer's disease can stop it?


well it's just a form of ageism at the end of the day (not suggesting you yourself are an ageist, but yeah), I would be very wary of applying a stereotype like that to anybody,

here recommend a read of David Mullich (Heroes 3 director)'s article, it supplies some good perspective on that topic lol


Look, there are some things at which you get better as you age and some things that you get worse at. That goes the other way around too. There's nothing wrong with accepting the weaknesses and strengths of your current age. Ageism is when you're using someone's age to justify their exclusion from something or to criticize them or belittle their abilities (that applies to all ages). Note that I never said that one can't create once -or before- they reach a certain age, I just argued that the average person's most productive and creative years are between the ages of 20 and 40. Most people are able to be creative also while they are outside those loosely defined boundaries, but their peak, on average, will be during those years. May I remind you how much better Spielberg, Lucas and Cameron were in their early years?

I already talked about scientists, so take musicians for example. Bands, singers, songwriters. The vast majority of non-scholar musicians have created their best works during their 20's and 30's. The same goes for writers. If you look up most classic pieces of literature, you will unsurprisingly find that most of them were written when their authors were young. Harper Lee died a few months ago. You may know her as the author of "To Kill a Mockingbird", which she wrote when she was 30-something. She died at age 89. Jane Austen wrote "Pride and Prejudice", her most famous novel, when she was 21. Herman Melville wrote "Moby-Dick" at 32. Alcott wrote "Little Women" when she was 36. Mary Shelley was 21 when she wrote "Frankenstein" (she died aged 53). Shakespeare died at 52 years of age, but he produced most of his best and best known works before his mid-40's. Dickens wrote most of his works between the ages of 25 and 48. Golding wrote "Lord of the Files" when he was 43. I could go on for hours. The point is that most people are more creative when they are younger. It's not only a matter of opinion, it's scientifically established too and the reasons behind it are very well understood and they are both sociological and biological in nature.

Maybe JVC is one of the rare exceptions. But his track record after the end of the 90's doesn't support this notion; at least not for the time being. I would be glad to be proven wrong by JVC but this requires a game.

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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby Baronus » Jun 11 2016, 21:29

My opinion was cutted. Some of us read this...
Sorry censorship for cultural and meritoric critics is unacteptable. I must say good bye.
I must leave forum because I dont have way to tell what I think. Thanks for all and all :-)

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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby Erwinner » Jun 12 2016, 2:00

hellegenes wrote:Look, there are some things at which you get better as you age and some things that you get worse at. That goes the other way around too. There's nothing wrong with accepting the weaknesses and strengths of your current age. Ageism is when you're using someone's age to justify their exclusion from something or to criticize them or belittle their abilities (that applies to all ages). Note that I never said that one can't create once -or before- they reach a certain age, I just argued that the average person's most productive and creative years are between the ages of 20 and 40. Most people are able to be creative also while they are outside those loosely defined boundaries, but their peak, on average, will be during those years. May I remind you how much better Spielberg, Lucas and Cameron were in their early years?

I already talked about scientists, so take musicians for example. Bands, singers, songwriters. The vast majority of non-scholar musicians have created their best works during their 20's and 30's. The same goes for writers. If you look up most classic pieces of literature, you will unsurprisingly find that most of them were written when their authors were young. Harper Lee died a few months ago. You may know her as the author of "To Kill a Mockingbird", which she wrote when she was 30-something. She died at age 89. Jane Austen wrote "Pride and Prejudice", her most famous novel, when she was 21. Herman Melville wrote "Moby-Dick" at 32. Alcott wrote "Little Women" when she was 36. Mary Shelley was 21 when she wrote "Frankenstein" (she died aged 53). Shakespeare died at 52 years of age, but he produced most of his best and best known works before his mid-40's. Dickens wrote most of his works between the ages of 25 and 48. Golding wrote "Lord of the Files" when he was 43. I could go on for hours. The point is that most people are more creative when they are younger. It's not only a matter of opinion, it's scientifically established too and the reasons behind it are very well understood and they are both sociological and biological in nature.

Maybe JVC is one of the rare exceptions. But his track record after the end of the 90's doesn't support this notion; at least not for the time being. I would be glad to be proven wrong by JVC but this requires a game.


though I can sincerely appreciate the time you took to build up a good rhetoric and deductions here, I just disagree,

it's just not convincing, you can say "it's not only a matter of opinion, it's scientifically established too and the reasons behind it are very well understood", but citation needed there actually, that's not even true according to the sources I've read (rather the datalogical trends tend to vary on a discipline by discipline basis, and there have been no studies dedicated to professionals in video games to my knowledge lol),

apart from the sociological aspect which is definitely true and probably the main barrier derailing other potential "exceptions", I don't think your correlations can imply causation here, by definition there's no such thing as the average genius or visionary, and in any case, not to cause offense, but I personally think it's rather disrespectful to hint at applying any ageist, racist or sexist prejudice or stereotype to somebody before the fact anyway even if you have very reliable data on trends in races, ages or sexes, we are just better off not even going there generally, it's disrespectful and if we do that it often just contributes to a self-fulfilling prophecy lol

Baronus wrote:My opinion was cutted. Some of us read this...
Sorry censorship for cultural and meritoric critics is unacteptable. I must say good bye.
I must leave forum because I dont have way to tell what I think. Thanks for all and all :-)


if it were me, and really no disrespect but just talking plainly here, I sort of wonder if it's a bit counterproductive for mods to be eager to create a fuss over petty things like "mildly offensive statements" at this point, when the forum is basically on its last legs now and probably soon to close, just my two cents but real talk, maybe a bit of strategic common sense is called for,

at a thriving or even semi-active forum it would obviously be completely right to punish rule breaches whether big and small normally, but I mean we all know this place is sadly on the way out already to be honest, in this case that kind of truculence just seems to chase off the couple of people like Baronus who still care enough to post and do create discussions even if flawed, but look I mean whatever helps the moderator sleep at night, it's a sad situation but ultimately no skin off my nose I guess

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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby Salamandre » Jun 12 2016, 9:18

Creativity does not go down with age, but the energy required to finish the work. You need to plan better, sleep more, rely more on ready mental structures before engaging the physical work, have a better discipline, better nutrition, date younger girls to keep the plumbing working and those kind of things. Your body starts to betray you, is part of life challenges, there is no racism in pointing it out.

Now the wrong part is placing JVC's games ideas on same required level of energy as Copernicus and Einstein. Even if I adore H2-H3, come on, those are trinkets.

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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby hellegennes » Jun 12 2016, 10:04

Salamandre wrote:Now the wrong part is placing JVC's games ideas on same required level of energy as Copernicus and Einstein. Even if I adore H2-H3, come on, those are trinkets.


No one said that. If you think the parallelism to scientific processes is far-fetched, have a look at what I wrote about literature.

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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby Galaad » Jun 16 2016, 20:42

Baronus wrote:All NWC team destroyed.


That's actually the part I'll never forgive Ubisoft about. They used some silly excuse to not work with NWC after they bought the rights, and gave us total crap instead. It's actually a miracle the brand still lives after so oh so many mistakes. But as they said there won't be a MMXI, I bet there won't be a H8 either, because arrogance mixed with incompetence is the worst combo ever.

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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby overall » Jun 18 2016, 22:13

Image
To: Baronus...
i came long time ago conclusion that moderators in this forum are somewhere between cops from Demolition Man and Planet of the Apes...
and Pol... well Pol ain't exactly smartest crocodile in this celestial pond...
so feel free doing whatever you were doing without minding them buzzing around...

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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby Xfing » Aug 3 2016, 9:13

If Ubisoft knew what's good for them, they could make and advertise MM as a competitor for The Elder Scrolls or something. Pandering to niche players was yet another bad decision (quite likely), since there are barely any players of MM1-5 younger than a certain age. I have little doubt that directing the game towards fans of 6-9 would have been more lucrative.

The only thing I hope for is that should the IP prove nonviable for Ubisoft, they'll agree to relinquish it to another company with a vision, rather than bury it.

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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby Talin_Trollbane » Oct 1 2016, 13:58

Xfing wrote:If Ubisoft knew what's good for them, they could make and advertise MM as a competitor for The Elder Scrolls or something. Pandering to niche players was yet another bad decision (quite likely), since there are barely any players of MM1-5 younger than a certain age. I have little doubt that directing the game towards fans of 6-9 would have been more lucrative.

The only thing I hope for is that should the IP prove nonviable for Ubisoft, they'll agree to relinquish it to another company with a vision, rather than bury it.


LOL yeah right, im pretty sure they wont just give the IP away for free when they can milk the Heroes section of it for years to come, and if it starts to "prove nonviable" for Ubi they might put it up for sale (big maybe on that), but for such a high price that no small and talented business can afford it anyway.

Im pretty sure the IP will be milked with Heroes until the market pukes and then Ubisoft will shrug, find the next thing to milk and bury the remains of MM in some basement.
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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby Neecko » Oct 7 2016, 3:42

http://www.dsogaming.com/news/ubisoft-e ... w-updates/

Well, this could be a good thing? But they only mention Heroes.

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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby jeff » Oct 7 2016, 16:39

Neecko wrote:Well, this could be a good thing? But they only mention Heroes.


That's because MM the RPG is dead. UBI is not willing to invest the time or money necessary to produce a quality product. Good RPGs are expensive, take a lot of development, and the return would probably be less than if the money was invested elsewhere.

As far as Heroes is concerned; IMHO UBI is done for a long while. The fanbase expectations will never be met by the product regardless of quality. As time passed with each substandard release the pessimism has now reached a point that UBI will never satisfy the Heroes fans; we expect failure even before anything is announced. Will UBI try another money grab, maybe, but without a change in ownership we can expect the same results. Anglespit mentioned it in another thread; perhaps it would be best that Heroes and the MM universe be retired, and another king be found.
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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby Erwinner » Oct 7 2016, 19:09

jeff wrote:Anglespit mentioned it in another thread; perhaps it would be best that Heroes and the MM universe be retired, and another king be found.


well the MM universe was already retired (read: sent to the abattoir) a whole decade ago mate lol

unless you mean the Erwin universe which has nothing to do with it, but that has no value lol

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Re: What do you think the future of Might and Magic Shall Behold?

Postby jeff » Oct 8 2016, 2:38

I did in fact mean that; though many of us have ignored it; we can't deny it happened. :S
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