Who liked Ubisoft's M&M X?

The role-playing games (I-X) that started it all and the various spin-offs (including Dark Messiah).

Moderator: Moderators

User avatar
waltc
Leprechaun
Leprechaun
Posts: 47
Joined: 18 Mar 2015

Who liked Ubisoft's M&M X?

Postby waltc » Mar 22 2015, 20:00

Eh, thought I'd ask although the question is a bit heretical here, I realize...;)

I thought it had potential, had Ubisoft not canned the developer's patching support a mere six months after the thing shipped...! Talk about snatching defeat from the jaws of victory...

Some things were ridiculous...like the Mage Quest, IIRC. There was absolutely no way anyone could have solved that thing w/o cheating...grrrr-r-r-r-r...when I looked at the solution after wasting 2-4 hours on a solution, all I could think of is "No WONDER I couldn't solve this...!" At least, not with the clues the game provided. Solved everything else w/o cheating...

Another thing I was disappointed in was the that when you upgraded equipment & armor your paper-doll inventory cutout never reflected the changes...M&M IX & < always did that fairly well, I think...
Win10x64
R5 1600 @ 3.8GHz
Radeon RX-480 8GB
16 GB ram
4.2 TB's of storage

User avatar
Tress
Raider
Raider
Posts: 788
Joined: 05 Dec 2007

Postby Tress » Mar 22 2015, 20:18

I think most damaging bugs were patched. Sure they could dish out some more addons and content in general, but overall I don't think that without extra help, game could be seen as incomplete.
Regarding puzzles. Yup some were extremely unforgiving, still it's part of charm. I did mage quest without any help (in fact if you mean 3x3 tile puzle i think it's quite common puzzle in general), still i had to cheat through air forge quest myself, but in ourdays there are lots of external help. that can help once you given up. It was far far worse in old games (which in fact it tries to mimic), where such puzzles were showstoppers altogether since there was no internet(or at least common acccess ) altogether.
Considering general lack of games in such genre, I think it did quite well (even if it wasnt anywhere close to perfect ) and I hope it paved way for additional sequels.

User avatar
Bandobras Took
Archmage
Archmage
Posts: 997
Joined: 06 Jan 2006

Postby Bandobras Took » Mar 23 2015, 4:55

I bought it because I feel that turn-based RPGs are an underused genre at the moment. While there were difficult areas, I also applaud the relatively easy cheating that allowed us to turn the game into what we wanted. :)

Overall, I've liked it.
Far too many people speak their minds without first verifying the quality of their source material.

User avatar
cori14
Leprechaun
Leprechaun
Posts: 17
Joined: 20 Jun 2011
Location: Hungary

Postby cori14 » Mar 23 2015, 9:58

I never played with MM games too much before MMX... But i loved the concept, but I couldn't get into the older games (now this was when MMX came out), so I bought the game even though I haven't really known much about it. So i bought and played with it till chapter 2 so not so much, but I really liked it, I don't know why I stopped playing with it. Anyway now that I played through MM6 and hopefully MM7 in the next few weeks, maybe I'll start with MMX again. :)

So as a non MM player myself, I quite liked it, the tile based movement, the combat, but Ashan isn't my favourite place :D

User avatar
Variol
Pit Lord
Pit Lord
Posts: 1249
Joined: 05 Sep 2008

Postby Variol » Mar 23 2015, 19:32

MMX was pretty good. Replayability was limited though, because you always get the same exp, due monsters being the same.

Of the 12 classes, I found most of them were not good at all. There are 2 or 3 classes that I found fun.
It's also limited because you need to have 1 class which can cast some type of light spell. Some places are too dark without it.

I do hope they make a "full" game. Leave the graphics etc alone; just make it more "random".

User avatar
Lord13
Demon
Demon
Posts: 311
Joined: 16 Jan 2006
Location: Around Harmondale

Postby Lord13 » Mar 24 2015, 7:56

I enjoyed both playthroughs (normal + hard) at MnM X. I found it a good cRPG, with oldschool feeling (party based, first person, tile based, turn based etc.) It is not a classic like MnM 6-8, but still an honest ressurection of a "dead" serie. It is a little "heavy" for its graphics (many ppl blamed Unity engine for this iirc), but still no major bugs after the patches. Could be better at class balance, and ofc the world of Ashan is so generic and cold if you compare it with the older MnM univerce. Also I would like to see some changes at combat mechanics, it is so "potion-based", at least at first hours, that feels little strange. Later as the game progress becomes more strategic and I really had some great cRPG moments. I will play it again soon for sure with diffirent party. I was a little disapointed for the mod-support also, they promised a mod-friendly enviroment, something that is not true. In the end, is a game that I would recomend to every cRPG lovers, offers many hours of fun.
Every man dies...
Every beast dies...
Only heroes live forever!

User avatar
Tress
Raider
Raider
Posts: 788
Joined: 05 Dec 2007

Postby Tress » Mar 24 2015, 8:38

Lord13 wrote:I enjoyed both playthroughs (normal + hard) at MnM X. I found it a good cRPG, with oldschool feeling (party based, first person, tile based, turn based etc.) It is not a classic like MnM 6-8, but still an honest ressurection of a "dead" serie. It is a little "heavy" for its graphics (many ppl blamed Unity engine for this iirc), but still no major bugs after the patches. Could be better at class balance, and ofc the world of Ashan is so generic and cold if you compare it with the older MnM univerce. Also I would like to see some changes at combat mechanics, it is so "potion-based", at least at first hours, that feels little strange. Later as the game progress becomes more strategic and I really had some great cRPG moments. I will play it again soon for sure with diffirent party. I was a little disapointed for the mod-support also, they promised a mod-friendly enviroment, something that is not true. In the end, is a game that I would recomend to every cRPG lovers, offers many hours of fun.


I disliked potion based I idea as well at the start. But then I just accepted it as "reload" button. If ranged would use arrows/bolts for their weapons noone would complain. Myself, i don't like to use consumables, so I had some problems duing first part of game due to that. Also fact that mana poool can be quickly spent, makes meditation and mana stats more important, since they unlock bigger potions , thus less time spent on reloading , in game where each move counts. If mechanics would be as in classics where you have enough mana for basically most fights and can reload between fights, then those stats are diminished value.

User avatar
Pitsu
Round Table Hero
Round Table Hero
Posts: 1812
Joined: 22 Nov 2005

Postby Pitsu » Mar 24 2015, 12:57

Variol wrote:MMX was pretty good. Replayability was limited though, because you always get the same exp, due monsters being the same.


I agree. Particularly Act I was in my opinion too pre-determined. Does anyone know anyone who has managed to do it solo from the begin?
But in general I'd say the game was much better than i feared and in several moments had a true might and magic feel.

User avatar
waltc
Leprechaun
Leprechaun
Posts: 47
Joined: 18 Mar 2015

Postby waltc » Mar 25 2015, 2:32

Tress wrote:I did mage quest without any help (in fact if you mean 3x3 tile puzle i think it's quite common puzzle in general), still i had to cheat through air forge quest myself, but in ourdays there are lots of external help.


There were a lot of "tile quests" in the game, kind of, but the one you allude to (and the one I'm talking about, I think) I thought was sort of ridiculous as IIRC it took *21 correct consecutive moves* to complete, and if you made one wrong move you'd have to start over--and there was nothing there to even tell you that you'd made a wrong move...!;) Usually that kind of tile quest solves in a maximum of 9-12 moves, total, and provides clear indication when you missed a step and needed to start over.

This thing was ridiculous--you could have tried random patterns for umpteen hours and still not gotten the solution to open the door...;) There's no way that anyone could solve this thing by making random moves, because the solution has *no pattern*, and the game provided no clues about it--I'd go so far as to say that absolutely no one could solve that "puzzle" w/o cheating...21 perfectly correct moves of right or left or forward or back, and sometimes two steps in sequence of forward or back or right or left--etc.--I can't see how it could be done without following the solution for it.

Yes, the Air forge was tough, too, but at least that one had a few patterns I could deduce--unlike that darned Mage (Grand Master?) Quest.

It was far far worse in old games (which in fact it tries to mimic), where such puzzles were showstoppers altogether since there was no internet(or at least common acccess ) altogether.
Considering general lack of games in such genre, I think it did quite well (even if it wasnt anywhere close to perfect ) and I hope it paved way for additional sequels.


Oh, I like tough puzzles--I just don't like a non-solvable "puzzle" masquerading as solvable--21 consecutive moves, with no mistakes and no backtracking allowed and no clues and no discernible pattern? No way that's happening, imo.

http://guides.gamepressure.com/mightand ... p?ID=23868

Here's the sequence:

Up, up, right, left, left, right, back, up, up, right, left, left, right, back, right, back, left, up, back, up, up.

Notice that is 21 sequenced moves with no leeway--you miss one move and the puzzle cannot be solved--but you don't know that, and you don't know when to start over, you don't know how many correct moves in sequence the puzzle takes, and there are no clues anywhere in the game that I could find that would have given you enough information so that you could solve the Archmage test by simply moving randomly until you chanced upon the solution.

When I was trying to solve that myself I figured maybe 10-12 moves in sequence should open the door--all I had to do was to figure out the pattern...but *21 consecutive perfect moves*...? I would never have solved that without following the guide as quoted above.

Ah, well...Ubisoft had a great opportunity to reboot the franchise, but it does not appear that is going to happen. The developers who did M&MX are moving on to a new M&M Heroes game (or so they say)...which doesn't interest me nearly so much. Some folks in the thread are optimistic about Ubisoft's plans, but I find it hard to share in the optimism.
Win10x64
R5 1600 @ 3.8GHz
Radeon RX-480 8GB
16 GB ram
4.2 TB's of storage

magritte2
Peasant
Peasant
Posts: 85
Joined: 07 May 2006

Postby magritte2 » Mar 25 2015, 20:45

It wasn't bad. It reminded me that if I'm going to be playing an RPG that's light on story and essentially all about killing monsters and gaining loot, that I MUCH prefer turn-based tactical combat to the Diablo/Torchlight style of combat.

User avatar
Tress
Raider
Raider
Posts: 788
Joined: 05 Dec 2007

Postby Tress » Mar 25 2015, 22:43

I'd go so far as to say that absolutely no one could solve that "puzzle" w/o cheating...21 perfectly correct moves of right or left or forward or back, and sometimes two steps in sequence of forward or back or right or left--etc.--I can't see how it could be done without following the solution for it.


I am pretty sure it's an exaggeration :D I certainly am not some sort of puzzle genius but it wasn't nearly worst puzzle i have seen in games. Besides I am pretty sure there are thousands of people who did it. it's a variation of quite common puzzle so I am sure it's slight overstatement to be worst puzzle of all times. :D Prety sure described one it's not nearly only solution, besides objective of puzzle is stated (at least implied,) so there are no clues necessary, just thinking how to make correct sequence.

User avatar
savetara
Dead Philosopher
Dead Philosopher
Posts: 399
Joined: 09 Dec 2008
Location: Canada
Contact:

Postby savetara » Mar 29 2015, 10:48

I liked it. Going back to the grid movement felt pretty good. I haven't completed the full game yet, I suspect I am mostly done though. The only thing I would have liked to see is more loot types, and possibly a little more open in regards to the world. It was a bit closed there for a while. Overall though, I did like it.
MIGHT AND MAGIC INSPIRED GAME: Legend of Erthia - Armageddon!
https://www.facebook.com/thelegendoferthia

User avatar
Variol
Pit Lord
Pit Lord
Posts: 1249
Joined: 05 Sep 2008

Postby Variol » Mar 29 2015, 14:34

savetara wrote:I liked it. Going back to the grid movement felt pretty good. I haven't completed the full game yet, I suspect I am mostly done though. The only thing I would have liked to see is more loot types, and possibly a little more open in regards to the world. It was a bit closed there for a while. Overall though, I did like it.


Hey, get back to finishing your game! :D

User avatar
Konfuzius
Pixie
Pixie
Posts: 125
Joined: 03 Jan 2009

Postby Konfuzius » Mar 29 2015, 14:57

I think it is alright.

I think it is a very good game overall, but it feels more like a normal grid based rpg game set in the (Ashan, sigh) MM universe.

I haven't finished it and I don't think I ever will, it simply doesn't give me the epic dungeon crawl experience I used to enjoy when playing other MM titles.


There are so many things I miss, but most of all I simply don't get the impression of being inside a huge world. Everything feels small and cramped and there is no real exporation part.

Sure, it's open world, but unlike other MMs you are constantly restricted from entering places you are not supposed to go yet. Also, the spells are kinda meh.

User avatar
savetara
Dead Philosopher
Dead Philosopher
Posts: 399
Joined: 09 Dec 2008
Location: Canada
Contact:

Postby savetara » Mar 29 2015, 18:57

Hahah! Work continues! I got some more updates coming in Monday or Tuesday. I thank especially you, Variol, for your patience. :D It's been rough road the last little while, but I have been back in progress with LOE for a bit now.

Variol wrote:
savetara wrote:I liked it. Going back to the grid movement felt pretty good. I haven't completed the full game yet, I suspect I am mostly done though. The only thing I would have liked to see is more loot types, and possibly a little more open in regards to the world. It was a bit closed there for a while. Overall though, I did like it.


Hey, get back to finishing your game! :D
MIGHT AND MAGIC INSPIRED GAME: Legend of Erthia - Armageddon!

https://www.facebook.com/thelegendoferthia

User avatar
Pitsu
Round Table Hero
Round Table Hero
Posts: 1812
Joined: 22 Nov 2005

Postby Pitsu » Mar 29 2015, 19:03

Konfuzius wrote:I think it is a very good game overall, but it feels more like a normal grid based rpg game set in the (Ashan, sigh) MM universe.


One thing i appreciated very much was the NPCs who implied that there is something much more beyond the borders of universe known to common Ashanians. And although not giving you blasters, the final main quests (assuming you could not kill the main antagonist in direct combat) was also such that made me wonder how did Ubisoft allow such things into the typical mediveal technology and politics. On the other had, I am no expert in Ashan lore, so maybe it wasn't really anything heretic.

User avatar
Panda Tar
Forum Mascot
Forum Mascot
Posts: 6448
Joined: 21 Feb 2006
Location: Florianópolis - Brasil

Postby Panda Tar » Mar 30 2015, 19:26

From my part, I thought the game provided enough fun. However, no matter how I look at it, I cannot see any replay-ability in it, given that many things are fixed.
"There’s nothing to fear but fear itself and maybe some mild to moderate jellification of bones." Cave Johnson, Portal 2. :panda:

User avatar
Corribus
Round Table Knight
Round Table Knight
Posts: 4994
Joined: 06 Jan 2006
Location: The Duchy of Xicmox IV

Postby Corribus » Apr 9 2015, 1:00

I loved the game. I thought they nailed the classic MM gameplay, atmosphere, and difficulty. Most fun I had with an RPG in a while. I would gladly play another just like it.
"What men are poets who can speak of Jupiter if he were like a man, but if he is an immense spinning sphere of methane and ammonia must be silent?" - Richard P. Feynman

Susil
Leprechaun
Leprechaun
Posts: 2
Joined: 30 Mar 2015

Postby Susil » Apr 12 2015, 14:35

waltc wrote:Notice that is 21 sequenced moves with no leeway--you miss one move and the puzzle cannot be solved--but you don't know that, and you don't know when to start over, you don't know how many correct moves in sequence the puzzle takes, and there are no clues anywhere in the game that I could find that would have given you enough information so that you could solve the Archmage test by simply moving randomly until you chanced upon the solution.


There aren't any in-game clues, but it is possible to spot the pattern of what the tiles do and then solve it from there. I also don't believe you can't go back - there's an 'ideal' solution to the puzzle but you can take a longer route. It's basically one of these games. Most of the tile puzzles had patterns that you could figure out, though I certainly did a few by trial and error.

On Might and Magic X in general... I thought it was a pretty good game. I'm playing it for a second time at the moment with a different party to the first and enjoying it again. I think one of the things that was done very well was making everything clear - like it's easy to tell what skills can reach what level, and I liked the little icons that appear when you buff that count down how many rounds they last. That's the sort of thing that makes getting into a series much easier for new players too!

I'd agree with the poster that described it as "cramped" though. Opening the world out just that bit more would have really helped. I don't necessarily mind there being a more restricted start (Emerald Isle being an example of it done well) though I feel like MMX got quite linear at the end too which was a shame.

In general, I'd say they got very close. It seems like a few tweaks with classes and skills, plus a bigger and more open world could have made it a really good game. Interestingly, did anyone get that survey sent to them by Ubisoft? Would be interesting to know if there's anyone out their listening to fan feedback...

User avatar
Panda Tar
Forum Mascot
Forum Mascot
Posts: 6448
Joined: 21 Feb 2006
Location: Florianópolis - Brasil

Postby Panda Tar » Apr 13 2015, 0:41

There's another game in that likeness ... hm ... Legend of Grimrock (1 and 2). It has some great reviews.
"There’s nothing to fear but fear itself and maybe some mild to moderate jellification of bones." Cave Johnson, Portal 2. :panda:


Return to “Might and Magic”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 19 guests