The Kreegan

The role-playing games (I-X) that started it all and the various spin-offs (including Dark Messiah).
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XEL II
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Unread postby XEL II » 03 Jul 2012, 15:07

Well, Kreegan forces in the Sweet Water Hive were enough to conquer the planet. The thing is, they wanted to eliminate possible threat to their conquest in the form of the kingdom of Enroth -- the largest and most powerful nation on the planet, which housed things like the Guardian, Control Center and Tomb of VARN. For that purpose, they created the Order of Baa. Its priority targets were Memory Crystals as shown in MM6.

The best analogy to this situation would be WarCraft with the Burning Legion using the Scourge to remove all forces that would threaten Legion's return to Azeroth.
Make you strong places to dwell and practice the evil of your arts. Build great monuments to stand through the ages and remind your followers of the task with which you have been charged. Use these halls of iniquity to perpetrate your schemes against the infestation that has taken the fields and lakes of this land from you, their rightful masters. Never forget the hatred that must finally overcome and consume mankind. Dwell in your dungeons and brood. - Sheltem the Dark

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Unread postby ywhtptgtfo » 03 Jul 2012, 23:15

XEL II wrote:Well, Kreegan forces in the Sweet Water Hive were enough to conquer the planet. The thing is, they wanted to eliminate possible threat to their conquest in the form of the kingdom of Enroth -- the largest and most powerful nation on the planet, which housed things like the Guardian, Control Center and Tomb of VARN. For that purpose, they created the Order of Baa. Its priority targets were Memory Crystals as shown in MM6.

The best analogy to this situation would be WarCraft with the Burning Legion using the Scourge to remove all forces that would threaten Legion's return to Azeroth.
That's almost pure fan fiction.

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Unread postby XEL II » 04 Jul 2012, 00:49

ywhtptgtfo wrote:
XEL II wrote:Well, Kreegan forces in the Sweet Water Hive were enough to conquer the planet. The thing is, they wanted to eliminate possible threat to their conquest in the form of the kingdom of Enroth -- the largest and most powerful nation on the planet, which housed things like the Guardian, Control Center and Tomb of VARN. For that purpose, they created the Order of Baa. Its priority targets were Memory Crystals as shown in MM6.

The best analogy to this situation would be WarCraft with the Burning Legion using the Scourge to remove all forces that would threaten Legion's return to Azeroth.
That's almost pure fan fiction.
Why do you think so? If so, could you support your point with facts from the games?
Make you strong places to dwell and practice the evil of your arts. Build great monuments to stand through the ages and remind your followers of the task with which you have been charged. Use these halls of iniquity to perpetrate your schemes against the infestation that has taken the fields and lakes of this land from you, their rightful masters. Never forget the hatred that must finally overcome and consume mankind. Dwell in your dungeons and brood. - Sheltem the Dark

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Unread postby ywhtptgtfo » 04 Jul 2012, 02:34

1. I have never read that Enroth's the strongest nation on the planet or the hive being able to conquer the planet alone (it could, but that's never explicitly said). Also, the headquarters is in Antagarich

2. The Tomb of VARN is a resources located within Enroth but not technically possessed by the crown

3. The Warcraft comparison is bad in many ways since there are many differences in the conditions

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Unread postby Avonu » 05 Jul 2012, 08:06

XEL II wrote:Well, Kreegan forces in the Sweet Water Hive were enough to conquer the planet.
Until they were stopped by Roland and forced to change their MO.
BoardGuest808888 wrote:Also It's unclear if their 'advanced' status means higher intelligence or somewhat.
They are both more advanced then people of Enroth and more intelligence. Most devils are just mindless workers or warriors but masters can speak, write, schame and use their adventages. It was only strategic genius of Roland and Catherine Ironfist (and Archibald's magic :D) who stopped the Kreegan threat once for the all - at least is what said Escaton in MM8.

It is hard to relize that from HoMM games as Kreegans are shown no more then ordinary devils but in MM games you can read more about their behaviours and schemes.

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Unread postby XEL II » 05 Jul 2012, 12:17

Avonu wrote: Until they were stopped by Roland and forced to change their MO.
They weren't "stopped", all that Roland repelled was a large Kreegan raiding party (lower echelon Kreegans, numerous but dumb and not that strong, being killed off very well by sword & sorcery) attacking Ebenbrook. I think you don't remember all the info from the letters well. Roland's army haven't even reached northern Paradise Valley (where Sweet Water and the Hive were loated) and was forced to retreat to Kriegspire when the Kreegan force they defeated in Edenbrook received reinforcements.

Besides, it isn't valid to say that they changed their MO after battles with Roland. The Order of Baa already existed by that time, beginning their work and eventually growing immensely in strenght and influence by the time of MM6. Suleman was their agent in Roland's ranks, remember?

And the info from the game (especially Zenofex's letters) makes it clear that the main potential threat to the upcoming Kreegan attack is the Oracle, who is the Guardian of Enroth, and that once Baa finished their job (utterly destabilazing the social and political situation, completely neutralizing the Oracle, uprooting the Ironfist rule) in the kingdom of Enroth, the world would fall before the Kreegan onslaught.

Roland's removal helped Baa further their agenda more quickly, as did the Restoration Wars (which they used to remove Catherine from Enroth) commencing in Antagarich.

@ywhtptgtfo:

1. The Hive was real threat to the planet as a whole, as Melian's words (urging the heroes to hurry up and blow up the Hive) show. Colony Zod was one of the Kreegan headquarters (where the leading King, Zenofex, resided) not the main one, which was the Hive, where the Queen who led the invasion resided.
As for Enroth being the strongest nation, it's implied numerous times in story and narrative, and is quite obvious just from the common sense: it's the biggest kingdom in the world (occupying the entire largest continent), uniting many different races and nations, and is described as being safer than, for instance, the continent of Erathia (aka Antagarich).

2. Yeah, I was rather inaccurate here (the crown indeed doesn't control the Tomb), but still I think you got my point. Tomb of VARN was not the biggest threat to the Kreegan invasion (not like the Guardian or Contol Center's pre-Silence equipmemt), but it did play a role in their downfall in the end.

3. The details and the context are different, for sure, but the overall concept is quite similar. Baa was for Kreegans in many ways what the Scourge was for the Legion -- a preliminary measure of removing potential threats to their invasion.
Make you strong places to dwell and practice the evil of your arts. Build great monuments to stand through the ages and remind your followers of the task with which you have been charged. Use these halls of iniquity to perpetrate your schemes against the infestation that has taken the fields and lakes of this land from you, their rightful masters. Never forget the hatred that must finally overcome and consume mankind. Dwell in your dungeons and brood. - Sheltem the Dark

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Unread postby Avonu » 06 Jul 2012, 08:43

XEL II wrote:They weren't "stopped", all that Roland repelled was a large Kreegan raiding party (lower echelon Kreegans, numerous but dumb and not that strong, being killed off very well by sword & sorcery) attacking Ebenbrook. I think you don't remember all the info from the letters well. Roland's army haven't even reached northern Paradise Valley (where Sweet Water and the Hive were loated) and was forced to retreat to Kriegspire when the Kreegan force they defeated in Edenbrook received reinforcements.
Oh, I remember it quite well. Kreegan forces didn't recive reinforcements - Roland defeat all Kreegans in Ebenbrook and next went to Sweet Water Pass. And after he saw numbers of the Kreegan, he retreted to Kriegspire, ambushing and looring into traps much of their forces before he was captured thanks to traitor aid.
This and the fact that Titans and Dragons from Dragonsand were enough to stop Kreegans, forced Xenofex to create Cult of Baa and Mandate of Heavens nonsense. ;)
I will check texts in free time but I am pretty sure, that Cult of Baa was introduced after Roland crusade.

On Antagarich Kreegan forces, after they conquered Eeofol in 1162 AS, were fighting Erathia and AvLee but they too were stopped, this time by Nighon Overlords... and there was peace for next 3 years.

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Unread postby Talin_Trollbane » 06 Jul 2012, 21:12

Avonu wrote:
XEL II wrote:Well, Kreegan forces in the Sweet Water Hive were enough to conquer the planet.
Until they were stopped by Roland and forced to change their MO.
BoardGuest808888 wrote:Also It's unclear if their 'advanced' status means higher intelligence or somewhat.
They are both more advanced then people of Enroth and more intelligence. Most devils are just mindless workers or warriors but masters can speak, write, schame and use their adventages. It was only strategic genius of Roland and Catherine Ironfist (and Archibald's magic :D) who stopped the Kreegan threat once for the all - at least is what said Escaton in MM8.

It is hard to relize that from HoMM games as Kreegans are shown no more then ordinary devils but in MM games you can read more about their behaviours and schemes.
Roland had only 500 men with him, and even less after some time at Kreigspire.
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Unread postby ywhtptgtfo » 06 Jul 2012, 21:13

XEL II wrote: 1. The Hive was real threat to the planet as a whole, as Melian's words (urging the heroes to hurry up and blow up the Hive) show. Colony Zod was one of the Kreegan headquarters (where the leading King, Zenofex, resided) not the main one, which was the Hive, where the Queen who led the invasion resided.
All Kreegan headquarters are dangerous, but the game's narrative has it that Zenofex and successor are calling the shots. There's no canonical details I know of that discusses the queen.
As for Enroth being the strongest nation, it's implied numerous times in story and narrative, and is quite obvious just from the common sense: it's the biggest kingdom in the world (occupying the entire largest continent), uniting many different races and nations, and is described as being safer than, for instance, the continent of Erathia (aka Antagarich).
We know little about Enroth's relative power. It's a powerful country, no doubt, but there's no indication that it is the most powerful. Also, it doesn't control the entire continent and it mostly rules over humans. Dwarves and ogres, for instance, do not answer to the King of Enroth.
2. Yeah, I was rather inaccurate here (the crown indeed doesn't control the Tomb), but still I think you got my point. Tomb of VARN was not the biggest threat to the Kreegan invasion (not like the Guardian or Contol Center's pre-Silence equipmemt), but it did play a role in their downfall in the end.
Doesn't the Tomb of VARN have blasters as well? The control center, on the other hand, is completely optional. It gives blaster rifles and that only makes the player's killing more efficient.
3. The details and the context are different, for sure, but the overall concept is quite similar. Baa was for Kreegans in many ways what the Scourge was for the Legion -- a preliminary measure of removing potential threats to their invasion.
You can say that to any situation that involves a great evil using a lesser evil as an initial strike force.

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Unread postby Daerandin » 07 Jul 2012, 14:09

ywhtptgtfo wrote:Doesn't the Tomb of VARN have blasters as well? The control center, on the other hand, is completely optional. It gives blaster rifles and that only makes the player's killing more efficient.
Actually, in MM6 you don't find blasters in the Tomb of VARN. At the very end of the dungeon you do encounter a small part that looks futuristic and there are a few robots encoutered there. But you don't find any blasters there, only the control cube which is required for Melian to give you access to the control center. It is only inside the control center that you find blasters and learn the blaster skill that let you use blasters.

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Unread postby MMXAlamar » 07 Jul 2012, 18:38

Tomb of VARN had blasters a long time ago. Who knows how different this location was before the Day of Fire! Perhaps the locals had greater access to the tomb.

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Unread postby BoardGuest808888 » 09 Jul 2012, 08:49

GreatEmerald wrote:Well, you should also not discount the effect of magic. People on Enroth can use it, some of them very effectively. And you can use laser cannons as much as you want, if there is a cleric casting raise dead all the time, you won't get all that far. The Kreegan numbers simply weren't enough to make a direct assault a viable approach. But being able to do things like casting meteor shower looks like something they can achieve via technology.
The Kreegans themselves can also use magic so it would even the odds anyway. That said, then it is the Laser Guns which won the day, not Roland/Catherine combo :-D

IIRC, according to that Destroyer man, they already consumed worlds after worlds prior their invasion to Antagarich.

Does that means their number simply weren't enough to overwhelm say, Erathia/Enroth or they didn't put enough numbers there ? Perhaps they tend to overlook Erathian defense, or perhaps a failure of their tactical doctrine? However, this just shows they are not that much more intelligence than what was presumed.

It's still not sure what this 'advanced' thing mean, but seems whatever it was, 'twas not a decisive factor for their performance in Antagarich. ;|

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Unread postby GreatEmerald » 09 Jul 2012, 21:09

BoardGuest808888 wrote:The Kreegans themselves can also use magic so it would even the odds anyway.
You can't be sure with Clarke's third law in effect.

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Unread postby Slayer of Cliffracers » 20 Jul 2012, 22:40

BoardGuest808888 wrote: The Kreegans themselves can also use magic so it would even the odds anyway. That said, then it is the Laser Guns which won the day, not Roland/Catherine combo :-D

IIRC, according to that Destroyer man, they already consumed worlds after worlds prior their invasion to Antagarich.

Does that means their number simply weren't enough to overwhelm say, Erathia/Enroth or they didn't put enough numbers there ? Perhaps they tend to overlook Erathian defense, or perhaps a failure of their tactical doctrine? However, this just shows they are not that much more intelligence than what was presumed.

It's still not sure what this 'advanced' thing mean, but seems whatever it was, 'twas not a decisive factor for their performance in Antagarich. ;|
Yes that is the basic problem with the Kreegans. As a highly advanced 'sci-fi' race they should basically be able to mop the floor with the 'fantasy' races of Enroth, both the continent and the world.

As I understand it though, the heroes of Might and Magic VI destroy the Kreegans main base with just a little help from the Ancients and prevent them from being able to conquer Enroth which they would otherwise have done.

The Kreegans which we face in Heroes of Might and Magic are however another branch of the Kreegan faction that is less advanced and arrives by magical means (and are generally attuned to magic). I take it as canon that they are also Kreegans since they are reffered to as such but they are not the one's that have hives and queens and such.

The relationship between the two kinds of Kreegan is a symbiotic one perhaps, the first kind of Kreegan devour all the resources and drive out all the inhabitents and then depart, leaving the barren world to the second kind of Kreegan. The second kind of Kreegan then turn that world into a molten and barren 'Fiery Realm' along the lines of the one depicted in Heroes IV.

When the first kind of Kreegans were eliminated in Might and Magic VII the second kind of Kreegan led by Lucifer decided to innovate and use a magical means (Armageddon's Blade) to eliminate the pesky locals.
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Unread postby XEL II » 21 Jul 2012, 10:47

Slayer of Cliffracers wrote:As a highly advanced 'sci-fi' race they should basically be able to mop the floor with the 'fantasy' races of Enroth, both the continent and the world.

As I understand it though, the Heroes of Might and Magic VI destroy the Kreegans main base with just a little help from the Ancients and prevent them from being able to conquer Enroth which they would otherwise have done.
From this entire post, this statement is correct, except that it's Might and Magic VI you're talking about, not Heroes of Might and Magic VI. The rest is your theory, which contradicts canon and has already been refuted time and time again in previous discussions.

I don't want to get into this again right now, but will just point out that the Kreegan in MM and HoMM are same race, and in Inferno, Kreegans are represented by the 7th level creature (note: those are generally Kreegan warrior "devils", not the upper echelon breeders).
Make you strong places to dwell and practice the evil of your arts. Build great monuments to stand through the ages and remind your followers of the task with which you have been charged. Use these halls of iniquity to perpetrate your schemes against the infestation that has taken the fields and lakes of this land from you, their rightful masters. Never forget the hatred that must finally overcome and consume mankind. Dwell in your dungeons and brood. - Sheltem the Dark

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Unread postby Slayer of Cliffracers » 22 Jul 2012, 13:17

XEL II wrote: From this entire post, this statement is correct, except that it's Might and Magic VI you're talking about, not Heroes of Might and Magic VI. The rest is your theory, which contradicts canon and has already been refuted time and time again in previous discussions.

I don't want to get into this again right now, but will just point out that the Kreegan in MM and HoMM are same race, and in Inferno, Kreegans are represented by the 7th level creature (note: those are generally Kreegan warrior "devils", not the upper echelon breeders).
No my theory does not contradict canon, there is no canonical statement that I am aware of that specifically disagrees with anything I have said. You just don't like my theory that's all, nothing wrong with that. But if you know of any lore that rules this out then please tell me but please don't dress yourself in canon enforcer clothes in order to attack theories that you simply don't like.

It could be that the devils are Kreegans in the hive sense (I admit this), except that being a 7th level creature doesn't really make sense as Kreegans are canonically referred to as a rapidly multiplying race that is perpetually out of balance with the ecosystem, consume all resources and then move on to another world. If Heroes III Inferno factions are establishing Kreegan hives in their cities THEN we would be seeing lots of devils rather than just a few every week.

But that's not an inexplicable problem. The problem is Heroes IV has devils in it but they are not 'center of attention'. That is important, how can highly advanced creatures that are inherantly out of balance with the ecosystem, violent and warlike be reduced to an optional appendage of the death faction?

And then the really inexplicable problem. Lucifer KREEGAN sets out to destroy ther world with but the Might and Magic VI/VII Kreegans are interested in the resources of the world and only incidentally destroy it. Why would the Might and Magic VI Kreegans create Armageddon's Blade?

My THEORY makes sense of all these things. That is why I advocate it, not because I am out to overturn Might and Magic canon.
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Unread postby Avonu » 22 Jul 2012, 14:08

Slayer of Cliffracers wrote:The Kreegans which we face in Heroes of Might and Magic are however another branch of the Kreegan faction that is less advanced and arrives by magical means (and are generally attuned to magic). I take it as canon that they are also Kreegans since they are reffered to as such but they are not the one's that have hives and queens and such.

(...)

No my theory does not contradict canon, there is no canonical statement that I am aware of that specifically disagrees with anything I have said.
Greg Fulton wrote:Science fiction is the foundation of the Might and Magic universe. It is the reason the Might and Magic universe exists. At its core, the Might and Magic is about advanced civilizations who have descend into barbarism. If you disagree, your reasoning is emotional, not logical. Many people forget the Inferno is not populated by demons. It’s populated by aliens who look like demons.
:P
Slayer of Cliffracers wrote:If Heroes III Inferno factions are establishing Kreegan hives in their cities THEN we would be seeing lots of devils rather than just a few every week.
Yes, because they had so many queens to breed new Kreegans, that they could put one of each in every city. :P
Slayer of Cliffracers wrote: Lucifer KREEGAN sets out to destroy ther world with but the Might and Magic VI/VII Kreegans are interested in the resources of the world and only incidentally destroy it. Why would the Might and Magic VI Kreegans create Armageddon's Blade?
You didn't pay attention, didn't you? It was not Lucifer Kreegan who knew about Armageddon's Blade, it was Xenofex (killed in MM7), who, in last seconds of his life, showed him Armegaddon's Blade in dream. Lucifer Kreegan was stupid enough to destroy planet and he failed and doomed his kind, while Xenofex was smart enough to hide and wait until Kreegan numbers would be great again and THEN try to conquer the world. If it weren't travellers from another world, who sent team to kill Xenofex, he could succeed.
Slayer of Cliffracers wrote:My THEORY makes sense of all these things.
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Unread postby Slayer of Cliffracers » 23 Jul 2012, 14:48

Avonu wrote:
Greg Fulton wrote:Science fiction is the foundation of the Might and Magic universe. It is the reason the Might and Magic universe exists. At its core, the Might and Magic is about advanced civilizations who have descend into barbarism. If you disagree, your reasoning is emotional, not logical. Many people forget the Inferno is not populated by demons. It’s populated by aliens who look like demons.
:P
Greg Fulton is a pretty solid example of why Death of the Author is a good idea.

His statement seems to demonstrate that he has never played Heroes III (ignoring IV, V & VI). The Inferno faction is mostly populated by various probably supernatural (judging from the gates and portals) beings that are allied to the Kreegans. The only creature that anyone (including XEL II) is arguing is a candaidate for being kreegans in the alien sense is the 7th level Devil unit. And among these allied being are demons, so his statement that the Inferno is not populated by demons is dead wrong.

He then goes on to insult anyone that disagrees with him by accusing them of being emotional and irrational. We all know that there is a Sci-Fi element to Might and Magic, but there is also a Fantasy element to it and that element has steadily gained ground as the series progressed (the earlier Might and Magics are seemingly more Sci-Fi than the later one's). Sci-Fi is effectively absent in the whole Heroes series so much so that when I initially found about the Sci-Fi element I was sort of surprised.

But as I understand it, the main Sci-Fi element of the Might and Magic universe is effectively ruled by the Ancients, powerful beings that create worlds essentially as experiments or playthings and inhabit them with a collection of creatures that they have either transplanted or created. In so far as they exist in barbarism it is probably an intentional one, the Ancients want them to independently develop according to their 'destiny'. However the being themselves are never directly encountered, they could actually be almost anything (I personally reckon they are the 'elementals' of the material plane that came into being with a perfect understanding of Natural Science).
Slayer of Cliffracers wrote: Yes, because they had so many queens to breed new Kreegans, that they could put one of each in every city. :P
If kreegans can't breed new queens and any kind of rate then how are they a rapidly multipying expansionist menace? Ants produce thousands of queens, less than 1% I reckon actually succeed in creating new colonies of ants.

The point is that the heroes of Might and Magic VI and VII destroy the Kreegan hives and queens. Whatever kreegans are left are essentially doomed to extinction anyway. Maybe the Inferno faction continued to make use of the remaining kreegans as devils for a while but it is implausable that Heroes IV devils are kreegans because between Heroes III Armageddon's Blade, Heroes Chronicles and the Reckoning just how many doomed Kreegan survivers can there be?
Slayer of Cliffracers wrote: You didn't pay attention, didn't you? It was not Lucifer Kreegan who knew about Armageddon's Blade, it was Xenofex (killed in MM7), who, in last seconds of his life, showed him Armegaddon's Blade in dream. Lucifer Kreegan was stupid enough to destroy planet and he failed and doomed his kind, while Xenofex was smart enough to hide and wait until Kreegan numbers would be great again and THEN try to conquer the world. If it weren't travellers from another world, who sent team to kill Xenofex, he could succeed.
Oh, I was misled to believe that Lucifer Kreegan overthrew the more sensible Xenofex and embarked on an 'insane' plot to destroy the world.

The best way to look at it is to see it as a bit like Rome and Byzantium. The Kreegans are not the same thing as the kreegans.

Initially the kreegans land (in a big fiery explosion) build a hive and recruit to themselves a variety of extra-planer creatures, of a destructive and evil character. As Falagar says in Might and Magic IV intro, "since the arrival of devils, foul creatures and evil spirits have appeared throughout the land (Enroth)".

The question is not what do the Kreegans get out of this arrangement, they get cannon-fodder and a diversion to keep people away from their hive as they build up their numbers; it's what do the allies (let's call them demons), what do the demons get for allying with the Kreegans? For any biological creature any permanant alliance with the Kreegan hive is madness, all you are doing is buying them time to multiply so they will inevitably destroy you too as 'competition'. Cult of Baa do ally with the Kreegans but they also ally with snakes, giant spiders, undead etc; they evidently believe in being nice to everyone (except the authorities!) and especially the bogeymen so madness can be expected. They even got driven out of one of their own temples by their own 'pet' creatures!

But what about actual demons and devils? Isn't supporting the Kreegans quite a rational thing to do. The Kreegans will ultimately overrun everything and devour it, laying waste to the world, everything that you are also trying to achieve. Once the Kreegans have eaten everything and moved on (or starved), the world belongs to the demons who can then turn it into a 'Fiery Realm' (like the one in Heroes IV), a molten hell on earth.

However because of the setbacks in Might and Magic VI the demons essentially become prevalant over the kreegans within the Kreegans faction. In Might and Magic III you never, ever face an army of actual kreegans. But the actual kreegans remain in charge and they are still using the Inferno faction to act as a buffer as they build a new hive in Eofol (I think). But in Might and Magic VII the last Kreegan queen dies so the kreegan race on Enroth is doomed to extinction. But they are still the one's in charge remember?

Without the potential to multiply rapidly and overrun Enroth, why should the demons not overthrow the kreegans, usurp the Kreegan faction completely and set out to conquer Enroth alone (ala Ashan)? Xenofex wasn't stupid, only by offering the demons a quicker, easier route to their goal could the few surviving kreegans mantain their control. So he told Lucifer Kreegan about Armageddon's Blade and Lucifer was able to mantain control over the demons by dangling the prospect of it before them.

Now once Lucifer Kreegan was defeated (I've never played Armaggedon's Blade so hazy on the details) the surviving kreegans were either killed by Catherine or overthrown by the demons and the Kreegans 'went home' to the Fiery Realm to escape Queen Catherine. They later re-emerged in Enroth shortly before the Reckoning as Nicolai refers to in Might and Magic IX. This is where the Rome and Byzantium analogy is apt.

Just as the Byzantines who were greek were Romans although they weren't the historical latin/roman people, the demons are still reffered to as the Kreegans even though they aren't actually any kreegans among them anymore.
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Unread postby XEL II » 23 Jul 2012, 15:58

Avonu, I honestly suggest you just not bothering.
Slayer of Cliffracers wrote: His statement seems to demonstrate that he has never played Heroes III
Yeah, he only was one of its main developers :)
Make you strong places to dwell and practice the evil of your arts. Build great monuments to stand through the ages and remind your followers of the task with which you have been charged. Use these halls of iniquity to perpetrate your schemes against the infestation that has taken the fields and lakes of this land from you, their rightful masters. Never forget the hatred that must finally overcome and consume mankind. Dwell in your dungeons and brood. - Sheltem the Dark

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Avonu
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Unread postby Avonu » 24 Jul 2012, 06:38

Slayer of Cliffracers wrote:His statement seems to demonstrate that he has never played Heroes III
Yes, of course he never played it:
Jon Van Caneghem wrote:In the last few weeks before any major product ships, just about everyone in the office is playing the game and reporting bugs. You could say our QA department quadruples in size at this time. It really helps work everything out.
As for the rest - no comment. You have been told no once, not twice, not even dozens of time about game facts and you still want to ignore them. Your choise, but your "Truth" will never be "righter", then what have been told in games or from game creators themselves.


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