Ultimate MM8 party

The role-playing games (I-X) that started it all and the various spin-offs (including Dark Messiah).

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UndeadHalfOrc
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Ultimate MM8 party

Postby UndeadHalfOrc » Jun 6 2011, 15:16

What do you think is the ultimate MM8 party, excluding any dragons, or unbalanced Lv50 characters that can join early?

Also assume you play MM8 like I do, MM6-7 style and (using MM8CHE) to create a full party of level 1 characters that will stay with you for the entire game (that means I get to start the game with two minotaurs, two necros, two trolls or two dark elves if I want, unlike the regular way of playing where you're stuck with one lv5 minotaur, one lv5 dark elf, one lv5 cleric, etc)

My favorite is:

Knight - Minotaur - Cleric - Necromancer - Dark Elf.

or

Knight - Vampire - Cleric - Necromancer - Dark Elf.

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Postby Avonu » Jun 6 2011, 15:57

Dark Elf - Necromancer - Cleric - Vampire - Minotaur

Sadly, Necro and Priest are must in party to cast all spells.

I usually play with 5 lvl characters and don't change them - only minotaur need to be swapped sometimes (for quest NPCs). Of corse later in game minotaur goes away in change of dragon but only Duroth the Eternal, not that weaker dragons from Garotte Gorge, Shadowspire or Ironsand Desert.

I played also with troll instead of DE but it wasn't fun for me (I prefer to play Elves, so having main character).

I also played once with swapping NPCs for their 50 lvl class NPCs and it wasn't fun at all. Developing your team from lvl 1 (or 5) to lvl 100+ is much better fun and challenge.

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Postby Tress » Jun 6 2011, 17:05

4 dragon + necro.... ,
excluding any dragons,
Damn nvm
Imo dark elf as protagonist since you cant get one till 3rd location. + Knight/vampire/cleric/troll(or another caster)
Minotaurs are relatively useless compared to other 2 melee classes.

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Postby Avonu » Jun 6 2011, 17:18

Useless or not I like them better then Trolls or Champions. If only they (or Vampires) could take role of Clerics or Champions (with Trolls).

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Postby GreatEmerald » Jun 6 2011, 18:12

tress wrote:Imo dark elf as protagonist since you cant get one till 3rd location.


I think that's the most canon choice of all, because people refer to you as the 'Merchant of Alvar', and Alvar is a Dark Elf town.

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Re: Ultimate MM8 party

Postby Konfuzius » Jun 6 2011, 19:36

UndeadHalfOrc wrote:What do you think is the ultimate MM8 party, excluding any dragons, or unbalanced Lv50 characters that can join early?

Also assume you play MM8 like I do, MM6-7 style and (using MM8CHE) to create a full party of level 1 characters that will stay with you for the entire game (that means I get to start the game with two minotaurs, two necros, two trolls or two dark elves if I want, unlike the regular way of playing where you're stuck with one lv5 minotaur, one lv5 dark elf, one lv5 cleric, etc)

My favorite is:

Knight - Minotaur - Cleric - Necromancer - Dark Elf.

or

Knight - Vampire - Cleric - Necromancer - Dark Elf.


Imo the strongest is:

Knight - 2 Blades or a blade/Spears enchanted with "of shadows" and a high armsmaster skill can demolish anything (on high levels definitely on par with a dragon)

Cleric - a must have for obvious reasons

Necromancer - no good party without some overkill spells (Armageddon grinding)

Vampire: Shows all monster resistances, good support and vampire spells, GM with a enchanted dagger of shadows kills most enemies and heals the char within seconds.

Dark Elf: A strong bow really makes the first third of the game a lot more enjoyable, high merchant skills along with good melee skills and GM in chain.


I don't used the followed because:

Minotaur: I know they are not that bad, but they are not that good either. GM axe is great but it is rather slow and doesn't hit that often. Perception is nice, but I know all secretes anyway. At the very beginning healing is an advantage but you can only access expert spells (after promo) which aren nothing compared to the master spells a Vampire can achieve, along with relatively low mana.
But I still like them, mostly they feel mightier than they are. Maybe it is because of the bad experience with minotaurs in MM6 xD.


Troll: mace, bodybuilding, leather and HP regen on GM is nice to have but nothing compared to GM in spear, blade, plate, repair, armsmaster and a good cleric.
Might be an interesting choice for a solo character.

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Avonu
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Re: Ultimate MM8 party

Postby Avonu » Jun 6 2011, 20:07

Konfuzius wrote:Vampire: Shows all monster resistances, good support and vampire spells, GM with a enchanted dagger of shadows kills most enemies and heals the char within seconds.


Another "must have" because of Levitate spell/ability (lava walk, avoiding floor traps).

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Re: Ultimate MM8 party

Postby UndeadHalfOrc » Jun 6 2011, 22:08

>>>Minotaur: I know they are not that bad, but they are not that good either. GM axe is great but it is rather slow and doesn't hit that often.

All they need to be decent is GM Plate to give them good attack speed. That's why I cheat to give them just that.


>>>Troll: mace, bodybuilding, leather and HP regen on GM is nice to have but nothing compared to GM in spear, blade, plate, repair, armsmaster and a good cleric.
Might be an interesting choice for a solo character.

You forgot to mention their main strength: GM Mace (Paralyze)

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Postby GrayFace » Jun 7 2011, 4:13

HP regen on GM is useless. Expert might be useful, but GM is just a waste of skill points.
Troll is really a good solo character with the paralyze ability. Knight was much better due to a vampiric spear (an artifact), but it's not guaranteed to be found. Without any vampiric items I think he would be weaker than troll. When I soloed (and haven't finished) minotaur I thought he would be much better with vampiric spear rather than some axe, but I haven't found the spear.
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Postby UndeadHalfOrc » Jun 7 2011, 12:32

Yeah, people often tend to forget that minotaurs can learn Spear as well.
Expert spear is all you really need.
Axes need 20 levels to catch up to Spear in speed.

Had Grayface not fixed the recovery bug, this would have been the definitive way to go.

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Postby tolich » Jun 7 2011, 13:03

UndeadHalfOrc wrote:Axes need 20 levels to catch up to Spear in speed.
And what about damage, hit rate and damage rate?

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Postby BMJedi » Jun 7 2011, 18:44

I recently started a five-member MM8 party based on Baldur's Gate 2. It's for fun, and for role-playing a "good" party, not for power.

I have:
me-sorcerer ("necromancer" NOT, photo swapped to young brown-haired human),
Jaheira-cleric (blonde human with stern voicings),
Anomen-knight (using Frederick's old photo and voice),
Imoen-dark elf ("thief", red-haired photo),
and Aerie-cleric (blonde with headband and Marilyn Monroe voice).
"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." - Arthur C. Clarke, "Clarke's Third Law".

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Postby DaveO » Jun 9 2011, 14:56

If you want a minimal party without going solo, then the best mix is Knight with Cleric/Vampire and Dark Elf.
I'd rather be part bull than a complete sheep.

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Postby MMXAlamar » Jun 9 2011, 18:06

The first time through MM8, I used a necromancer. Eventually all of my other characters were hirelings who surpassed my necromancer, and he wasn't that useful from then on.

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Postby tolich » Jun 9 2011, 19:00

Yes, it's a shame that a starting character cannot be fired. :-D

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Postby BoardGuest808888 » Jun 18 2011, 9:45

It's difficult to determine what makes a balanced or powered party because they got different aspect.

For a balanced party, for me it would be :

Knight, Vampire, Dark Elf, Cleric, Necromancer.

In that order. Then all the GM skills are covered and all magics/spell-like abilities enabled.

However, if only power & ability to dispatch target counts, it would be :

Troll, Knight, Minotaur/Vampire, Cleric, Necromancer.

In that order. You got tons of HP & regenerating abilities, very high damage output and chance to quickly disable targets.

You can use either Minotaur or Vampire, being minotaur get better HP and vampire get better spells. In close combat the both are quite same, though minotaur get physical resistance. In ranged combat vampire is obviously better.

Without counting on Lvl 50 dark elf (Cauri), dark elves got few HPs (even compared to vampires). They also don't get damage addition from skills in any melee weapon. Sure, they get damage addition for bows, but bows don't get strength bonus. Darkfire is powerful, but the 30 mp casting cost is too much (even with expert Meditation). You'll be better with vampire's Life Drain, it does half as much damage (no resistance except undead) but only costs 3 mp.

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Postby UndeadHalfOrc » Jun 18 2011, 14:40

BoardGuest808888 wrote:dark elves got few HPs (even compared to vampires).


Actually, they get the same HP per level bonuses, promoted and not promoted

BoardGuest808888 wrote:vampire's Life Drain, it does half as much damage (no resistance except undead) but only costs 3 mp.


5 MP. But I agree that life drain is very reliable at all times, and complements mistform perfectly.

It would be interesting to go through the entire game using nothing but vampires. Once GM Vampire and Mistform is attained, enemies using physical attacks are powerless while you pound on them with lifedrain, or flying fist/psychic shock.

You could opt to ignore armor/bows/dagger skills from now on and put every point in vampire skill.

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Postby Xfing » Jul 6 2011, 22:23

The best party option is obviously enough,

Knight/Troll/Minotaur/Dragon - Dark Elf - Vampire - Cleric - Necromancer.

I put them in order from highest health to lowest, but I'm not sure if the game mechanics actually consider that the "front" and "back" of your party when it comes to soaking up damage, but whatever.

The game is perfectly completable without any dragons in your party, so just choose your preferred warrior class instead. Trolls are like more tanky knights, and minoutaurs, surprisingly, have less health than Knights, but are up there with the trolls combat-wise thanks to Master Armsmaster. The DE is simply awesome - a warrior mage with Grand Merchant and Disarm, you can't go wrong with these guys. The vamps are fun for their self realm magic and dual Dagger/Sword damage output, while Clerics and Necros are musts for obvious reasons.

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Postby GreatEmerald » Jul 7 2011, 8:08

Xfing wrote:I put them in order from highest health to lowest, but I'm not sure if the game mechanics actually consider that the "front" and "back" of your party when it comes to soaking up damage, but whatever.


No, there is no front or back. That was dropped as early as in MM3, with MM2 having only a limited version of that.

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Postby BoardGuest808888 » Jul 10 2011, 4:30

UndeadHalfOrc wrote:Actually, they get the same HP per level bonuses, promoted and not promoted

It would be interesting to go through the entire game using nothing but vampires. Once GM Vampire and Mistform is attained, enemies using physical attacks are powerless while you pound on them with lifedrain, or flying fist/psychic shock.

You could opt to ignore armor/bows/dagger skills from now on and put every point in vampire skill.


Sorry, I mean initial HP. Dark elves somehow get lower than usual HP from endurance always.

Using all vampires is unfortunately very difficult, given some monsters do cast spells (spells with AoE like fireballs especially bad for vampires) and vampires given to you mostly suck. Only first lvl 5 & lvl 15 vampires are of any notable use.

But I've tried this, they excel in Arena fights, where monsters are limited and leveled.


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