MM6 spells...if you could - what will you change?

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vladimir-maestro
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MM6 spells...if you could - what will you change?

Unread postby vladimir-maestro » 12 May 2009, 10:37

This is dual theme with transparent background line...
Spells in MM6 are not ideal and maybe not balanced - I always wondered why spells are made so "static"...remember easiest spells in MM6 - they always do static damage about 3-8 and have n matter how many points you put in that magic - spell will always do bad damage...

Or remember Body magic Heal - that got 2 healing spells but 1 is USELESS!!! Or Spirit touch that heals static 5-11 HP...

Or Day of Protection as a Dark Magic...
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So topic is about MM6 magic. If you got a power to rewrite some spells - which one you will change\replace\give new abilities?

My friend now developing a codes of MM6 spells - so in nearest future we could change their effect or dependensies to change a balance or add new spells.

For now we've replaced old "Spirit touch" - that was useless with it's 5-11 HP...onto "Soul Change" - that will heal player's mana (ofcouse cost will be greater than effect).
Also all basic elementary combat spells now depends of magic skill level (1-2 per skill level).
Day of Protection moved to Light Magic etc.
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What do you think or suggest?
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hobowu
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Unread postby hobowu » 12 May 2009, 12:28

the stun in earth magic... is practically useless. (does anyone use it?)
Maybe replace it with the slow from light magic?

I suppose slow is more... "earthy" (thinks back to the casting animation of slow from homm3)

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vladimir-maestro
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Unread postby vladimir-maestro » 12 May 2009, 18:03

Interesting idea, indeed!

But which spell do instead of Light Slow then???
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motter28218
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Unread postby motter28218 » 13 May 2009, 20:51

Hey Vlad,

Just curious, how are you guys re-coding the spells? I assume it's BDJ doing it right, would you ask him to get in touch with me if he has the time, I'd like to learn how to do this, I suppose I can figure it out on my own, haven't tried to mod the spells yet, but thought all that was controlled by the exe file??? Anyhow, look forward to playing the mod when it's done.

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vladimir-maestro
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Unread postby vladimir-maestro » 14 May 2009, 12:38

TCC team refused to include changes for skills and spells - so in original game they will be the same...

Me and Sergey are planning to do some changes in skills and spells to make a kind of a skill \ spell tree.

That means that 1 skill will affect another skills or even a spells.
For Example:
Blades spell (earth magic)
If caster knows Sword\Axe skills - this spell will have more damage depends of weapon skills...
Heal (body)
If user got Light magic - his\her Heal will be greater.

Fireball:
If user knows Mind magic - spell will do more damage (druid only!!)
If user knows Dark magic - spell will have increased radius of effect (sorcerer only!)

Dagger:
If uses knows Dagger skill but uses a Sword insted - even there - dagger will grant passive recovery speed to sword.
Spear + Shield:
Combo of 2 skills will give gteat bonuses (like a cavalier bonus in Heroes 3 game)

ETC...And much more that fantasy can generate.
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After we will complete the exams - we will work under skills\spells patch that will entend and change them...after that I will give it to TCC team and if they will found it good - we will include this patch into the MOD...if they won't - it will stay as an unofficial fan addon.
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The main problem here is a balance. In some cases skills and spells could be to overpowered due to skill-tree effect...that means that all monsters and items have do be corrected to...

P.S.
Yes, skills and spells are coded in EXE file.
You can contact me here:
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vladud @ yandex.ru - preferred one
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Site about MODs: http://www.mmgames.ru
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if you wish to upload some materials for this site - let me know.

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Macros the Black
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Unread postby Macros the Black » 14 May 2009, 19:07

Why so complicated, Vladimir? The only thing I like about your suggestion is that it might make the Druid more useful..

Now as for which spells to change..

First off, make the other "basic" spells as useful as Wizard Eye, Torch Light and Cure Weakness. Some ideas to make that happen:
- Change "Awaken" to "Insomnia" which protects against Sleep effects as well as curing it. Make more creatures cause it. If one of your characters has this spell on him and you sleep, you can't get a random encounter but your character won't heal up either (he can't sleep so he's been standing watch). Give us a way to remove the spell prematurally though if you go that way.
- Likewise, change "Cure Fear" to "Bravery" which prevents the fear condition as well as curing it.
- Then you might as well change Cure Weakness into something that prevents weakness, although this spell doesn't really need to boost but it should make sence that way. Converly, you could change Cure Poison into Anti-Venom (like Insomnia and Bravery) and make that the basic body spell and move Cure Weakness up a bit.
- Make Stone Skin, Bless and Heroism the 1 point cost spells of Earth, Spirit and... something new? Respectively. I feel these spells are of the same caliber as Wizard Eye, Torch Light and Cure Weakness.
To recap:
Fire Magic: Torch Light
Air Magic: Wizard Eye
Water Magic: Insomnia
Earth Magic: Stone Skin
Spirit Magic: Bless
Mind Magic: Bravery or Heroism (actually since those words are pretty much synonyms, perhaps you could make a spell that does both?)
Body Magic: Strength (as the opposite of Weakness) or Anti-Venom.
That means all the basic spells are now just as useful.

Some other things I'd fix...:
- Replace the spell Haste with something new. Or change it so it increases the party's walking speed instead of their fighting speed.
- Make Water Walk more useful. Maybe you could have a dungeon where it needs to be used instead of flight. Otherwise, you could replace the spell I guess, but it's kinda symbolic for Water Magic so I don't know about that.
- Do something about Enchant Item so you can't exploit it.
- What would be cool is if you had a spell called Static Field, which works like a magnet on Sparks, causing them to encircle your party. This way it could work kinda like the Immolation spell in MM7.
- Fix Mind Magic.. almost none of those spells actually work in MM6. But make is less potent, because if those spells all worked.. That'd be overpowered perhaps?
- Make the Spirit Magic heal more useful or replace it. I was thinking of a spell that heals someone's spell points. Of course the cost is bigger than the result, but it would be nice if your Druid could share some of his huge spell point pool with a sorcerer for instance..

Well that's all I think of right now.

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vladimir-maestro
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Unread postby vladimir-maestro » 14 May 2009, 20:01

All affects with duration are hard to replace -> other magic will lose their power (day of protection\ hour of power). Im MM6 - they just cast all other spells together. If change strengct, meditation, haste or other affect spells - this spells will change too!

It is impossible to add new affect statuses like regeneration. Duration effects are limited and can be only replaced with something...but this will affect other spells.

So only spells with no duration statuses can be reworked or changed some effects of their statuses.

It is impossible to create a status-preventing spell with duration...but it is possible to do a permanent skill effect - like master in body\mind\spirit will gain immunity to weakness, sleep, insanity etc.
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Macros the Black
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Unread postby Macros the Black » 14 May 2009, 22:52

Then please change Haste. It's not too bad if HoP loses the Haste effect, because that's exactly the reason why I want to get rid of the spell Haste :)

Basically, Haste is too powerful compared to the other buffing spells: Stone Skin, Bless and Heroism. Combined with certain weapons it is just too good. But the real pain is that HoP casts Haste, along with the other buff spells. Haste's duration is however way lower than the other buffs, and it causes weakness when it ends. Very annoying as you either have to remember recasting HoP way before the other effects end, or cast Haste every once in awhile, or keep casting Cure Weakness all the time.

I wouldn't mind getting rid of the Haste spell altogether and just having a bugged/non-working spell in it's place if that's what it has to come down to.. ;|

So.. if you can't change Awaken and such, maybe we should just switch the places of some spells around? Is that possible, or would that also mess up DotG, HoP and DoP?

So I take it that you can't create all new spells with completely new effects?

Can you make duration spells last indefinately at master level? That might be interesting.

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vladimir-maestro
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Unread postby vladimir-maestro » 15 May 2009, 05:44

Hm...
What kind of spells were bugged or didn't work properly in original MM6? Maybe we could fix them...such as 12 spells in Light magic but only 11 avaible ;| 12th was the Paralyze that cannot be learned. If there is a place for such status as the Paralyzation - I guess this spell could be possible to apply as well it was in MM7-8.
You can contact me here:
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vladud @ yandex.ru - preferred one
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koval321
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Unread postby koval321 » 15 May 2009, 13:57

MM6 spells...if you could - what will you change?
Amount of them (more), i often play four mages and usualy when have all element spells it become boring, because nothing new to learn.

few idea:
Fire pig: create burn monster who run at enemies and explode
Infravision: version of light which allow to see hidden treasure (alternate perception)
Anyway many spells which work trough some time like skill or stat:
Battlemage: allow mage to use sword (fire sword) or create in his hand magic weapon, earth magic create hammer, watermagic ice rapier, and better skill in magic mean longer have this weapon and more damage
Magic coin: everything have low price because using illusion money
Fire wall, make wall trough monsters cant go
Paradox: caster fall into madness or drunken effect and trough some time have random ability or may use magic unavailable for him for example spiritual healing

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Big Daddy Jim
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Unread postby Big Daddy Jim » 15 May 2009, 14:06

vladimir-maestro wrote:Hm...
What kind of spells were bugged or didn't work properly in original MM6? Maybe we could fix them...such as 12 spells in Light magic but only 11 avaible ;| 12th was the Paralyze that cannot be learned. If there is a place for such status as the Paralyzation - I guess this spell could be possible to apply as well it was in MM7-8.
Vladamir,

You can both learn and use Paralyze in MM6 (TCC). It's very effective against some 'bosses'.

FYI ...

BDJ
"BDJ the Coding Wizard has moved out of the Coding Fortress, has retired from Might & Magic game modification, and now lives a peaceful life in Alto Lino, Republic de Panama.

http://www.mediafire.com/BDJs

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vladimir-maestro
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Unread postby vladimir-maestro » 15 May 2009, 17:00

Noooo!!!
It will be a cheat to fight with bosses by Paralyze!!! Party should experience all their fierce and fury without this spell!! :(

Or give boss immunity to Magic and set Paralyze status to Magical to prevent Paralyze work on bosses :S
You can contact me here:
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vladud @ yandex.ru - preferred one
---
Site about MODs: http://www.mmgames.ru
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if you wish to upload some materials for this site - let me know.


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